• Hey folks

    From Bulifyf@VERT/KN6Q to All on Tue Oct 24 20:35:00 2023
    Hey Everyone,

    I'm not sure if i'm intruding here on your BBS. I'm from Canada, and my first home computer we played on local BBS's and the community was awesome! I was looking for a version of a TW game and that's how I came across this.

    Hope you are all doing well, the nostalgia here is awesome :)

    Thanks for being here

    John

    ---
    Synchronet Desert Rats Sanctuary --- https://bbs.kn6q.org
  • From Unc0nnected@VERT/REALITY to Bulifyf on Wed Oct 25 19:27:45 2023
    Re: Hey folks
    By: Bulifyf to All on Tue Oct 24 2023 08:35 pm

    I'm not sure if i'm intruding here on your BBS. I'm from Canada, and my first home computer we
    played on local BBS's and the community was awesome! I was looking for a version of a TW game and
    that's how I came across this.
    Hope you are all doing well, the nostalgia here is awesome :)

    Where abouts in Canada? I grew up in Kamloops and what I love is that even in towns of 50,000 or less there were dozens and dozens of boards. Is this your first time back on a BBS since? What was it about that TW game that got you back on now after so long out of curiosity?
    ---
    Synchronet .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.
  • From Boraxman@VERT/MSRDBBS to Bulifyf on Thu Oct 26 19:40:34 2023
    Re: Hey folks
    By: Bulifyf to All on Tue Oct 24 2023 08:35 pm

    Hey Everyone,

    I'm not sure if i'm intruding here on your BBS. I'm from Canada, and m first home computer we played on local BBS's and the community was awesome! was looking for a version of a TW game and that's how I came across this.

    Hope you are all doing well, the nostalgia here is awesome :)

    Thanks for being here

    John

    Welcome!

    I'm sure intrustions are more than welcome, provided you don't go out of your way to cause trouble!

    It's great nostalgia, but even so I still enjoy using the format, the simplicity of the BBS.

    ---
    Synchronet MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org
  • From Bulifyf@VERT/KN6Q to Unc0nnected on Thu Oct 26 09:09:00 2023
    Re: Hey folks
    By: Unc0nnected to Bulifyf on Wed Oct 25 2023 07:27 pm

    Hey,

    I live in Nova Scotia, and work as a Paramedic, currently do rotation work outside Yellowknife in the NWT. When i'm up here I have some downtime, and my laptop isn't the strongest for gaming. I had downloaded some older games i used to play like Diablo and Guild Wars 1, but they had gotten a little old.

    When I was 12 or 13, our computer was a 486 and we used to connect to 3 BBS's in our town. I know my older brother in Halifax had a huge list he could choose from. The games I remember us playing was LORD, TW and a MUD which was really fun, tons of time invested in the MUD.

    With TW I remember they installed the BORG on it, and my older brother had gotten me to watch the Star Trek TOS episode about the corbomite devices, and saving for the Interdictor Cruiser. So as an adult, i'll occasionally drop pop culture references about TW or BBS's in general.

    So the other day (sorry for the long winded message) I was thinking I should try to find if there is a TW game online somewhere, it never occurred to me to locate a BBS. So here I am, and yes this is the first one i've been on in .... 20 years .... ish.

    Anyway, thanks for being here, this is quite awesome! I've never been to Kamloops, but I had worked in Fort Nelson on an LNG site previously, and in Fort McMurray also .... which I know is nowhere near Kamloops. But closer than Nova Scotia.

    ---
    Synchronet Desert Rats Sanctuary --- https://bbs.kn6q.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Bulifyf on Thu Oct 26 06:41:00 2023
    Bulifyf wrote to All <=-

    I'm not sure if i'm intruding here on your BBS. I'm from Canada,
    and my first home computer we played on local BBS's and the community
    was awesome! I was looking for a version of a TW game and that's how I came across this.

    Welcome - these message bases are shared across many BBSes. Your message reached me in Santa Cruz, California just fine!



    ... Don't bite the hand that feeds you WiFi.
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
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  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to Bulifyf on Thu Oct 26 20:32:00 2023
    I live in Nova Scotia, and work as a Paramedic, currently do rotation outside Yellowknife in the NWT. When i'm up here I have some downtime, an aptop isn't the strongest for gaming. I had downloaded some older games i to play like Di

    Wow, that's quite the trek for your rotation work but I have to imagine the money makes it all worth while and I've heard that it is beautiful up there,
    or actually in both places if I am honest, both of which I would love to
    visit. What are you running for a laptop, I'd love to make some recommendations based on hardware. I actually think in one of the echos
    there is an active discussion about retro game recommendations you might want to check out, I'll try to dig it up for you.

    When I was 12 or 13, our computer was a 486 and we used to connect to 's in our town. I know my older brother in Halifax had a huge list he cou ose from. The games I remember us playing was LORD, TW and a MUD which was y fun, tons of

    Sounds very familiar. My parents upgraded my 8086 to 386SX and then to a 386DX2 and I thought that it just couldn't get any better than that. I can't remember if I ever upgraded to a 486 or went straight to a Pentium, really makes me wish I had journaled or taken pictures back in the day to remember. There's a buncch of boards with all of those games running and a lot of
    boards are running inter-board versions of them so that you can play with players from all over the place, not just that board you are connecting to. The Reality Check BBS (realitycheckbbs.org:23) has a ton of BBSLink games.

    locate a BBS. So here I am, and yes this is the first one i've been on i
    20 years ....

    Amazing, well welcome back. Have you watched the BBS documentary by Jason Scott? It's a great way to take yourself back to the good ole days and stoke the fire :)

    Anyway, thanks for being here, this is quite awesome! I've never bee amloops, but I had worked in Fort Nelson on an LNG site previously, and in McMurray also .... which I know is nowhere near Kamloops. But closer than

    Well not close but also not too far, we all know of Fort Nelson and Fort Mac where we're from. Not missing much but if you have a chance to visit the Okanagan where I also grew up, it's definitely worth the trip. Great having you here, hope you have some fun and rekindle that magic from when you were 12!

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to unc0nnected on Thu Oct 26 19:26:43 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to Bulifyf on Thu Oct 26 2023 08:32 pm

    Sounds very familiar. My parents upgraded my 8086 to 386SX and then to a 386DX2 and I thought that it just couldn't get any better than that. I

    As far as I remember, there was never such a thing as a 386DX2.. The fastest 386 I remember was AMD's 386DX-40. The 'DX2' designation started with the 486DX2-66 (clock-doubled from 33mhz), from what I remember.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Kryten@VERT/STARBUGB to Nightfox on Fri Oct 27 11:46:45 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nightfox to unc0nnected on Thu Oct 26 2023 19:26:43

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to Bulifyf on Thu Oct 26 2023 08:32 pm

    Sounds very familiar. My parents upgraded my 8086 to 386SX and then t > un> 386DX2 and I thought that it just couldn't get any better than that. I >
    As far as I remember, there was never such a thing as a 386DX2.. The fastes > 386 I remember was AMD's 386DX-40. The 'DX2' designation started with the
    486DX2-66 (clock-doubled from 33mhz), from what I remember.

    Nightfox

    You're right Nightfox. I remember the DX2 as 486 too.

    regards
    Mark

    ---
    Synchronet Starbug BBS - 5.70.105.17
  • From The Lizard Master@VERT/NITEEYES to Nightfox on Fri Oct 27 07:01:31 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nightfox to unc0nnected on Thu Oct 26 2023 07:26 pm

    Sounds very familiar. My parents upgraded my 8086 to 386SX and then to a 386DX2 and I thought that it just couldn't get any better than that. I

    As far as I remember, there was never such a thing as a 386DX2.. The fastest 386 I remember was AMD's 386DX-40. The 'DX2' designation started with the 486DX2-66 (clock-doubled from 33mhz), from what I remember.

    I don't remember a DX2 either, I seem to remember a 386DX just had a math co-processor? I supposed a quick google would set the record straight haha. I just remember we had something called a 386DX for high school draft class.

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  • From Terry@VERT/AMIGACTY to unc0nnected on Fri Oct 27 10:59:05 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to Bulifyf on Thu Oct 26 2023 20:32:00

    I do recall there were two variants of intel's 386. There was the SX variant and the DX variant. The DX variant was manufactured in the Philipines. The DX variant also accepted a math co-processor add-on. I owned a 386DX with a math co-processor to boost system performance when using AutoCAD in 1991.

    ---
    Synchronet Sent from the Amiga City BBS
  • From Weatherman@VERT/TLCBBS to Nightfox on Fri Oct 27 10:57:56 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to Bulifyf on Thu Oct 26 2023 08:32 pm

    Sounds very familiar. My parents upgraded my 8086 to 386SX and then to a 386DX2 and I thought that it just couldn't get any better than that. I

    As far as I remember, there was never such a thing as a 386DX2.. The fastest 386 I remember was AMD's 386DX-40. The 'DX2' designation started with the 486DX2-66 (clock-doubled from 33mhz), from what I remember.

    Nightfox

    ---
    I don't remember a 386DX2 either, but I had one of those AMD 386DX-40's. Was a decent little chip and would give the popular at that time 486SX-25 a run for its money. The chip I really liked was the 486DX4-100. Now THAT was fun chip to run and it began my decades-long preference for AMD chips....


    Regards,
    -==*>Weatherman<*==-

    ---
    Synchronet The Lost Chord BBS - Cheyenne, WY
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Weatherman on Fri Oct 27 11:59:08 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Weatherman to Nightfox on Fri Oct 27 2023 10:57 am

    I don't remember a 386DX2 either, but I had one of those AMD 386DX-40's. Was a decent little chip and would give the popular at that time 486SX-25 a run for its money. The chip I really liked was the 486DX4-100. Now THAT was fun chip to run and it began my decades-long preference for AMD chips....

    Yeah, I also had an AMD 386DX-40 for a little while. It was a nice processor and quite capable of running the software of the day for a while.

    I had been using AMD processors for a long time, from 1993 to 2011 when I built an Intel desktop (I was working for Intel at the time, and Intel employees could buy Intel CPUs for half of retail price). My current desktop is one I built in 2019, also with an Intel processor. I'd heard AMD's processors from around 2019 and newer have been giving Intel a run for their money (again), and I've thought about using AMD again for my next desktop.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From fusion@VERT/CFBBS to Weatherman on Fri Oct 27 17:08:00 2023
    On 27 Oct 2023, Weatherman said the following...

    I don't remember a 386DX2 either, but I had one of those AMD
    386DX-40's. Was a decent little chip and would give the popular at that time 486SX-25 a run for its money. The chip I really liked was the 486DX4-100. Now THAT was fun chip to run and it began my decades-long preference for AMD chips....

    i feel like this was also when you started seeing overclocking pictures and video with the russian guys with their computer crammed into a freezer

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/25 (Windows/32)
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  • From Weatherman@VERT/TLCBBS to fusion on Sat Oct 28 01:05:00 2023
    fusion wrote to Weatherman <=-

    On 27 Oct 2023, Weatherman said the following...

    I don't remember a 386DX2 either, but I had one of those AMD
    386DX-40's. Was a decent little chip and would give the popular at that time 486SX-25 a run for its money. The chip I really liked was the 486DX4-100. Now THAT was fun chip to run and it began my decades-long preference for AMD chips....

    i feel like this was also when you started seeing overclocking pictures and video with the russian guys with their computer crammed into a
    freezer

    Yeah, I never got into the overclocking fad. Seems to me a lot of those people were just trying to see how far they could push the chip to get the best benchmark numbers and didn't give a crap about stability. I figure if a chip is designed to run at a certain speed then that's fine for me.

    Of course, this coming from the person who would spend a considerable amount of time looking for that optimum hard drive interleave ratio in order to boost throughput in read/write operations.....



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  • From Boraxman@VERT/MSRDBBS to Terry on Sat Oct 28 21:28:52 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Terry to unc0nnected on Fri Oct 27 2023 10:59 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to Bulifyf on Thu Oct 26 2023 20:32:00

    I do recall there were two variants of intel's 386. There was the SX variant and the DX variant. The DX variant was manufactured in the Philipines. The D variant also accepted a math co-processor add-on. I owned a 386DX with a mat co-processor to boost system performance when using AutoCAD in 1991.


    The DX variant didn't have a math co-processor. It was the 486 where the coprocessor was introduced. The main difference between the 386 SX and DX was the SX had a smaller 16 bit data bus (?)_ to make for budget PCs

    ---
    Synchronet MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org
  • From Boraxman@VERT/MSRDBBS to Weatherman on Sat Oct 28 21:30:24 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Weatherman to Nightfox on Fri Oct 27 2023 10:57 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to Bulifyf on Thu Oct 26 2023 08:32 pm

    Sounds very familiar. My parents upgraded my 8086 to 386SX and the to a 386DX2 and I thought that it just couldn't get any better than that. I

    As far as I remember, there was never such a thing as a 386DX2.. The fastest 386 I remember was AMD's 386DX-40. The 'DX2' designation started with the 486DX2-66 (clock-doubled from 33mhz), from what I remember.

    Nightfox

    ---
    I don't remember a 386DX2 either, but I had one of those AMD 386DX-40's. W a decent little chip and would give the popular at that time 486SX-25 a run its money. The chip I really liked was the 486DX4-100. Now THAT was fun c to run and it began my decades-long preference for AMD chips....


    Regards,
    -==*>Weatherman<*==-

    That is a great chip. I have one in one of my 486's. I've actually got a 486 33, 486 DX2 66MHz and 486 DX4 100 that I can swap freely in that computer.

    ---
    Synchronet MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org
  • From Dumas Walker@VERT/CAPCITY2 to THE LIZARD MASTER on Sat Oct 28 10:33:00 2023
    I don't remember a DX2 either, I seem to remember a 386DX just had a math co-p
    cessor? I supposed a quick google would set the record straight haha. I just r
    ember we had something called a 386DX for high school draft class.

    DX in the 386 world meant that the system was fully 32-bit. SX meant,
    IIRC, that the processor was 32 but everything else was 16 -- that may not
    be exactly right, but it did mean a mix of 16 and 32-bit.

    In the 486 world, DX meant the built-in math co-processor was active, while
    SX meant it was disabled or absent.

    "DX2" could have been used by someone selling an upgrade-to-386DX kit to indicate something, but this would be the first I have heard of it.


    * SLMR 2.1a * Beam me aboard Scotty. Aye, will a 2x4 do captain?

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  • From HusTler@VERT/BEERS20 to Dumas Walker on Sat Oct 28 13:34:00 2023
    I don't remember a DX2 either, I seem to remember a 386DX just had a mat co-processor? I supposed a quick google would set the record straight haha. I

    I never understood why a math co-processor was a big deal? All computers do is processes math. huh?
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Sat Oct 28 08:56:00 2023
    Nightfox wrote to unc0nnected <=-

    As far as I remember, there was never such a thing as a 386DX2.. The fastest 386 I remember was AMD's 386DX-40. The 'DX2' designation
    started with the 486DX2-66 (clock-doubled from 33mhz), from what I remember.

    I know they made a SX version without a coprocessor, and AMD made a
    compatible chip that ran at 40 mhz.

    Oh, clock doubled 486es, that was a rabbit hole of a debate back then -
    was a 486/50 faster at certain processor-intensive apps than a DX2/66?

    I was in the 486/50 camp. :)




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  • From Digital Man@VERT to HusTler on Sat Oct 28 15:50:21 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: HusTler to Dumas Walker on Sat Oct 28 2023 01:34 pm

    I don't remember a DX2 either, I seem to remember a 386DX just had a mat co-processor? I supposed a quick google would set the record straight haha. I

    I never understood why a math co-processor was a big deal? All computers do is processes math. huh?

    There's a big difference between "integer" (whole number) math and "floating point" (fractional) math. A math co-processor (e.g. the 8087, 80287, 80387 in the earliest intel x86 days) only dealt with floating point math problems while the CPU (8086, 8088, 80286, 80386) dealt with integer math. If you were dealing with a lot of floating point math (scientific equations, CAD/CAM design), the addition of a math co-processor would make a *huge* difference in the performance of the computer.

    In modern times, the floating point math problems are usually handled by a "floating point unit" (FPU) that is integrated into the CPU. Low cost/power microcontrollers often don't have an FPU and they (like CPUs lacking an FPU or math co-processor) must solve floating point math problems with (relatively slow) software algorithms.
    --
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Boraxman on Sat Oct 28 17:50:59 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Boraxman to Terry on Sat Oct 28 2023 09:28 pm

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Terry to unc0nnected on Fri Oct 27 2023 10:59 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to Bulifyf on Thu Oct 26 2023 20:32:00

    I do recall there were two variants of intel's 386. There was the SX variant and the DX variant. The DX variant was manufactured in the Philipines. The D variant also accepted a math co-processor add-on. I owned a 386DX with a mat co-processor to boost system performance when using AutoCAD in 1991.


    The DX variant didn't have a math co-processor. It was the 486 where the coprocessor was introduced. The main difference between the 386 SX and DX was the SX had a smaller 16 bit data bus (?)_ to make for budget PCs

    i had a 386dx with a math coprocessor.
    ---
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Oct 28 16:22:25 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Sat Oct 28 2023 08:56 am

    As far as I remember, there was never such a thing as a 386DX2.. The
    fastest 386 I remember was AMD's 386DX-40. The 'DX2' designation started
    with the 486DX2-66 (clock-doubled from 33mhz), from what I remember.

    I know they made a SX version without a coprocessor, and AMD made a compatible chip that ran at 40 mhz.

    I believe SX and DX meant different things for 386 and 486. For the 386, I seem to remember neither had a co-processor built-in, and the DX referred to a full 32-bit external bus or something (vs. 16-bit external bus for the SX), and DX for the 486 meant it had a co-processor built-in.

    Oh, clock doubled 486es, that was a rabbit hole of a debate back then - was a 486/50 faster at certain processor-intensive apps than a DX2/66?

    I was in the 486/50 camp. :)

    I remember that. I briefly had a 486/50 and it did seem pretty fast.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to MRO on Sat Oct 28 16:26:26 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Boraxman on Sat Oct 28 2023 05:50 pm

    The DX variant didn't have a math co-processor. It was the 486 where the
    coprocessor was introduced. The main difference between the 386 SX and DX
    was the SX had a smaller 16 bit data bus (?)_ to make for budget PCs

    i had a 386dx with a math coprocessor.

    Was it a separate chip? I had a 386DX-40 for a little while in the 90s, and I thought the motherboard had a separate socket for a math co-processor.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Digital Man@VERT to MRO on Sat Oct 28 18:55:37 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Boraxman on Sat Oct 28 2023 05:50 pm

    i had a 386dx with a math coprocessor.

    So you had an 80387?
    --
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  • From Digital Man@VERT to All on Sat Oct 28 19:08:24 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to MRO on Sat Oct 28 2023 06:55 pm

    So you had an 80387?

    When I was building and selling PCs and networks in the late 80s, I got a special build request to add an 80387 (this before there were SX or DX variants) to a 386 desktop order. I figured the 387's pins were keyed (could only be inserted in the socket in the correct orientation) and didn't notice the marked corner on the chip and corresponding inidcator on the socket. Turning on the PSU resulted in a loud pop and the smoke in the 387 was released. You never forget that smell... the smell of $300 going up in smoke. :-(
    --
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  • From Hustler@VERT/REALITY to Digital Man on Sun Oct 29 05:05:06 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to HusTler on Sat Oct 28 2023 03:50 pm

    I never understood why a math co-processor was a big deal? All computers do
    is processes math. huh?

    There's a big difference between "integer" (whole number) math and "floating point" (fractional) math. A math co-processor (e.g. the 8087, 80287, 80387 in the earliest intel x86 days) only dealt with floating point math problems while the CPU (8086, 8088, 80286, 80386) dealt with integer math. If you

    Thank you for that DM. I had no idea. :-)


    |12HusTler


    ...How does this work, is there an orientation?
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  • From Dr. What@VERT/CPMDEN to Dumas Walker on Sun Oct 29 08:08:00 2023
    Dumas Walker wrote to THE LIZARD MASTER <=-

    DX in the 386 world meant that the system was fully 32-bit. SX meant, IIRC, that the processor was 32 but everything else was 16 -- that may
    not be exactly right, but it did mean a mix of 16 and 32-bit.

    The insides were 32-bit, but with a 16-bit data bus. Sort of like the original 8086 (16 bits inside, 8-bit data bus).


    ... Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most!
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  • From Dr. What@VERT/CPMDEN to HusTler on Sun Oct 29 08:12:00 2023
    HusTler wrote to Dumas Walker <=-

    I never understood why a math co-processor was a big deal? All
    computers do is processes math. huh?

    All computers do video processing too. But now we have dedicated video processors (some of which are used for AI systems).

    The math co-processor simply does certain math stuff faster. So if you have a greatly math-intensive application (I'm thinking about the noise and vibration processing that I saw at GM Powertrain Engineering), a math co-processor will greatly speed things up.

    For most processing, it does nothing. Hence making it an option in most PCs at the time.


    ... Professionals built the Titanic, amateurs built the ark.
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Sun Oct 29 07:56:50 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nightfox to MRO on Sat Oct 28 2023 04:26 pm

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Boraxman on Sat Oct 28 2023 05:50 pm

    The DX variant didn't have a math co-processor. It was the 486 where the
    coprocessor was introduced. The main difference between the 386 SX and DX
    was the SX had a smaller 16 bit data bus (?)_ to make for budget PCs

    i had a 386dx with a math coprocessor.

    Was it a separate chip? I had a 386DX-40 for a little while in the 90s, and I thought the motherboard had a separate socket for a math co-processor.

    i'm pretty sure it did. it was like 1993 so hard to remember that far back. ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Digital Man on Sun Oct 29 08:01:43 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to MRO on Sat Oct 28 2023 06:55 pm

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Boraxman on Sat Oct 28 2023 05:50 pm

    i had a 386dx with a math coprocessor.

    So you had an 80387?

    it might have been. i just remember running diagnostics on it and
    it said it had a math coprocessor. it was a good little junky computer.

    my uncle got a bunch of dumpster computers from his work and gave them to me.
    I don't have any photos and it's hard to remember that far back.

    I remember i had a memory addon card what was ghetto and i tried to install os2 on it and a few of the disks were bad.
    ---
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to HusTler on Sun Oct 29 11:32:00 2023
    HusTler wrote to Dumas Walker <=-

    I never understood why a math co-processor was a big deal? All
    computers do is processes math. huh?

    Some apps, like CAD, compilers and spreadsheets benefitted from a
    co-processor, especially when CPU speeds were measured in megahertz.

    I bought a 287 when I was writing code in college, and it made
    magnitudes of difference when compiling code.




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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Dr. What on Sun Oct 29 13:20:59 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Dr. What to Dumas Walker on Sun Oct 29 2023 08:08 am

    The insides were 32-bit, but with a 16-bit data bus. Sort of like the original 8086 (16 bits inside, 8-bit data bus).

    You're thinking of the 8088 (8-bit data bus). The original IBM PC and most
    PC clones used the 8088 instead of the 8086 (and its 16-bit data bus).
    --
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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Sun Oct 29 16:58:34 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to All on Sat Oct 28 2023 07:08 pm

    When I was building and selling PCs and networks in the late 80s, I got a special build request to add an 80387 (this before there were SX or DX variants) to a 386 desktop order. I figured the 387's pins were keyed (could only be inserted in the socket in the correct orientation) and didn't notice the marked corner on the chip and corresponding inidcator on the socket. Turning on the PSU resulted in a loud pop and the smoke in the 387 was released. You never forget that smell... the smell of $300 going up in smoke. :-(

    Ouch.. :(

    Nightfox

    ---
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  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to Nightfox on Sun Oct 29 20:59:00 2023
    As far as I remember, there was never such a thing as a 386DX2.. The fast 6 I remember was AMD's 386DX-40. The 'DX2' designation started with the 4 66 (clock-doubled from 33mhz), from what I remember.

    It was definitely a 40Mhz machine so then it must have been a DX

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  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to Terry on Sun Oct 29 21:00:00 2023
    I do recall there were two variants of intel's 386. There was the SX varia
    the DX variant. The DX variant was manufactured in the Philipines. The DX nt also accepted a math co-processor add-on. I owned a 386DX with a math c essor to boost

    Maybe that led some folks to think of it as a DX2 as the co-processor was the second processing unit in there. Bringing back all sorts of memories now, I didn't now their origin though, thanks for sharing

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  • From Unc0nnected@VERT/REALITY to Weatherman on Sun Oct 29 18:29:48 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Weatherman to Nightfox on Fri Oct 27 2023 10:57 am

    Sounds very familiar. My parents upgraded my 8086 to 386SX and then to a 386DX2 and I
    thought that it just couldn't get any better than that. I

    As far as I remember, there was never such a thing as a 386DX2.. The fastest 386 I remember was
    AMD's 386DX-40. The 'DX2' designation started with the 486DX2-66 (clock-doubled from 33mhz), from
    what I remember.

    I don't remember a 386DX2 either, but I had one of those AMD 386DX-40's. Was a decent little chip
    and would give the popular at that time 486SX-25 a run for its money. The chip I really liked was
    the 486DX4-100. Now THAT was fun chip to run and it began my decades-long preference for AMD
    chips....

    I completely forgot the 486's had a DX4 variant, I think I went from the 386DX-40 to a Pentium2 so I missed out on all of those fancy upgrades. I remember looking on with envy as I played some game on my friends Pentium-75. I can even remember the smell of those old machines like it was yesterday.
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  • From Unc0nnected@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Sun Oct 29 18:34:45 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nightfox to Weatherman on Fri Oct 27 2023 11:59 am

    I don't remember a 386DX2 either, but I had one of those AMD 386DX-40's. Was a decent little chip
    and would give the popular at that time 486SX-25 a run for its money. The chip I really liked
    was the 486DX4-100. Now THAT was fun chip to run and it began my decades-long preference for
    AMD chips....

    Yeah, I also had an AMD 386DX-40 for a little while. It was a nice processor and quite capable of
    running the software of the day for a while.

    I had been using AMD processors for a long time, from 1993 to 2011 when I built an Intel desktop (I
    was working for Intel at the time, and Intel employees could buy Intel CPUs for half of retail
    price). My current desktop is one I built in 2019, also with an Intel processor. I'd heard AMD's
    processors from around 2019 and newer have been giving Intel a run for their money (again), and I've
    thought about using AMD again for my next desktop.

    Around 2017 is when I'd say AMD started giving Intel a run for it's money, they sent us a bunch of CPU's for our studio, a 1600x, 1700x and a few others in that line and it worked because we have almost exclusively been AMD ever since. It feels like Intel is brute forcing their was to competitive performance these days with chips that are using 300+ watts to eek out 5% more performance than a 125Watt AMD chip that costs less. We've found the AMD platform to be more stable, a FAR better bang for your buck and when it comes to workloads that are going to make us of 12-16 physical cores much better performance than Intel. As a convert I can tell you that you won't look back after switching to team red.
    ---
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  • From Unc0nnected@VERT/REALITY to Weatherman on Sun Oct 29 18:37:15 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Weatherman to fusion on Sat Oct 28 2023 01:05 am

    Yeah, I never got into the overclocking fad. Seems to me a lot of those people were just trying to
    see how far they could push the chip to get the best benchmark numbers and didn't give a crap about
    stability. I figure if a chip is designed to run at a certain speed then that's fine for me.

    It's a nice way to breath a little life into an aging CPU, where (with a solid AIO watercooler) you can eek 10% more performance out of it instead of spending $500-$1000 to upgrade your CPU probably requiring a new mobo and ram, to get 20-30%.
    ---
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  • From Jagossel@VERT/DMINE to Digital Man on Mon Oct 30 07:56:05 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to All on Sat Oct 28 2023 07:08 pm

    When I was building and selling PCs and networks in the late 80s, I got a special build request to add an 80387 (this before there were SX or DX variants) to a 386 desktop order. I figured the 387's pins were keyed (could only be inserted in the socket in the correct orientation) and didn't notice the marked corner on the chip and corresponding inidcator on the socket. Turning on the PSU resulted in a loud pop and the smoke in the 387 was released. You never forget that smell... the smell of $300 going up in smoke

    Woofah... how much trouble did you get into afterward? I get that was a life lesson on its own, though.
    ---
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  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Unc0nnected on Mon Oct 30 06:36:00 2023
    Unc0nnected wrote to Weatherman <=-

    I completely forgot the 486's had a DX4 variant, I think I went from
    the 386DX-40 to a Pentium2 so I missed out on all of those fancy
    upgrades.

    That's quite a leap!

    I remember looking on with envy as I played some game on my
    friends Pentium-75. I can even remember the smell of those old
    machines like it was yesterday.

    I remember how hot the first Pentiums seemed. I don't recall any of my
    486es having CPU fans, only heat sinks?



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  • From The Lizard Master@VERT/NITEEYES to Boraxman on Mon Oct 30 06:37:36 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Boraxman to Terry on Sat Oct 28 2023 09:28 pm

    owned a 386DX with a mat co-processor to boost system performance when using AutoCAD in 1991.


    The DX variant didn't have a math co-processor. It was the 486 where the coprocessor was introduced. The main difference between the 386 SX and DX was the SX had a smaller 16 bit data bus (?)_ to make for budget PCs

    The coprocessor was a separate chip add on. I had the same experience with AutoCAD in the 90's on a 386.

    ---
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  • From The Lizard Master@VERT/NITEEYES to Nightfox on Mon Oct 30 06:40:08 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nightfox to MRO on Sat Oct 28 2023 04:26 pm

    i had a 386dx with a math coprocessor.

    Was it a separate chip? I had a 386DX-40 for a little while in the 90s, and I thought the motherboard had a separate socket for a math co-processor.

    AFAIK it was always a separate chip in that slot.

    ---
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  • From The Lizard Master@VERT/NITEEYES to unc0nnected on Mon Oct 30 06:43:38 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to Terry on Sun Oct 29 2023 09:00 pm

    I do recall there were two variants of intel's 386. There was the SX varia
    the DX variant. The DX variant was manufactured in the Philipines. The DX nt also accepted a math co-processor add-on. I owned a 386DX with a math c essor to boost

    Maybe that led some folks to think of it as a DX2 as the co-processor was the second processing unit in there. Bringing back all sorts of memories now, I didn't now their origin though, thanks for sharing

    Speaking of memories, I was able to run AutoCAD on a 386SX and it wasn't too bad. There was a math coprocessor emulator that I would run to get past the "no math coprocessor" check in the beginning.

    ---
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  • From Phigan@VERT/TACOPRON to Unc0nnected on Mon Oct 30 07:51:14 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Unc0nnected to Nightfox on Sun Oct 29 2023 06:34 pm

    As a convert I can tell you that you won't look back after switching to team red.

    I haven't gotten a chance to play with much of the Ryzen line yet, but over the years (since the 90s) I've tried several times to switch over to AMD. Each time, the computer seemed very laggy to me. Just running 'ls' in Linux, you can see how the whole thing hesitates before showing you the output. With an Intel CPU of the same generation, eveything always seems snappier/faster. The same goes when it comes to stability. I hear so may good things from people about AMDs, but I just never lucked out enough to experience them.

    ---
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  • From nelgin@VERT/EOTLBBS to Phigan on Mon Oct 30 12:45:45 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Phigan to Unc0nnected on Mon Oct 30 2023 07:51:14

    I haven't gotten a chance to play with much of the Ryzen line yet, but over the years (since the 90s) I've tried several times to switch over to AMD. Each time, the computer seemed very laggy to me. Just running 'ls' in Linux, you can see how the whole thing hesitates before showing you the output. With an Intel CPU of the same generation, eveything always seems snappier/faster. The same goes when it comes to stability. I hear so may good things from people about AMDs, but I just never lucked out enough to experience them.

    I've run AMDs as long as I can remember and never had any problems running linux. Even my 486 DX4-100 AMD chip ran Linux in its 4mb of memory booting off 2 floppy disks without issue :)

    These days I have a Ryzen 5 3600 and it's quite nippy. No lag, no delay.

    I'd maybe put it down to user error or skills issue ;)
    ---
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  • From Dumas Walker@VERT/CAPCITY2 to DR. WHAT on Mon Oct 30 08:20:00 2023
    DX in the 386 world meant that the system was fully 32-bit. SX meant, IIRC, that the processor was 32 but everything else was 16 -- that may not be exactly right, but it did mean a mix of 16 and 32-bit.

    The insides were 32-bit, but with a 16-bit data bus. Sort of like the origina
    8086 (16 bits inside, 8-bit data bus).

    Thanks. "Data bus" was the part I was missing. ;)


    * SLMR 2.1a * Save the kids! Trade them for valuable prizes!

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  • From Digital Man@VERT to nelgin on Mon Oct 30 17:29:30 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: nelgin to Phigan on Mon Oct 30 2023 12:45 pm

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Phigan to Unc0nnected on Mon Oct 30 2023 07:51:14

    I haven't gotten a chance to play with much of the Ryzen line yet, but over the years (since the 90s) I've tried several times to switch over to AMD. Each time, the computer seemed very laggy to me. Just running 'ls' in Linux, you can see how the whole thing hesitates before showing you the output. With an Intel CPU of the same generation, eveything always seems snappier/faster. The same goes when it comes to stability. I hear so may good things from people about AMDs, but I just never lucked out enough to experience them.

    I've run AMDs as long as I can remember and never had any problems running linux. Even my 486 DX4-100 AMD chip ran Linux in its 4mb of memory booting off 2 floppy disks without issue :)

    These days I have a Ryzen 5 3600 and it's quite nippy. No lag, no delay.

    I'd maybe put it down to user error or skills issue ;)

    I've gone back and forth between Intel and AMD based motherboards/CPUs over 30 years. The only systems that have had CPU stability issues (e.g. over-heating, tricky DRAM compatibility) were non-Intel systems (AMD, Cyrix). When I was working at Broadcom (16+ years), Intel was our biggest competitor (for network controllers), so I actively boycotted Intel when spending my own money on computers. The computers I buy these days usually have Intel processors (especially the workstations), but I honestly don't really care that much. I have the lingering impression that Intel is better (than AMD) at quality control, but it's probably not a rational impression anymore.
    --
    digital man (rob)

    Sling Blade quote #10:
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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Jagossel on Mon Oct 30 17:52:45 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Jagossel to Digital Man on Mon Oct 30 2023 07:56 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to All on Sat Oct 28 2023 07:08 pm

    When I was building and selling PCs and networks in the late 80s, I got a special build request to add an 80387 (this before there were SX or DX variants) to a 386 desktop order. I figured the 387's pins were keyed (could only be inserted in the socket in the correct orientation) and didn't notice the marked corner on the chip and corresponding inidcator on the socket. Turning on the PSU resulted in a loud pop and the smoke in the 387 was released. You never forget that smell... the smell of $300 going up in smoke

    Woofah... how much trouble did you get into afterward? I get that was a life lesson on its own, though.

    It was my own company, so I didn't get any trouble, I just had to delay the delivery of the system to the customer while I waited for a replacement 80387. That $300 (or whatever it was) was basically my total profit on that particular computer build, just up in smoke. So yeah, lesson learned: not all expensive ICs are keyed; check your orientation markers carefully.
    --
    digital man (rob)

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  • From Digital Man@VERT to Jagossel on Mon Oct 30 18:05:03 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to Jagossel on Mon Oct 30 2023 05:52 pm

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Jagossel to Digital Man on Mon Oct 30 2023 07:56 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to All on Sat Oct 28 2023 07:08 pm

    When I was building and selling PCs and networks in the late 80s, I got a special build request to add an 80387 (this before there were SX or DX variants) to a 386 desktop order. I figured the 387's pins were keyed (could only be inserted in the socket in the correct orientation) and didn't notice the marked corner on the chip and corresponding inidcator on the socket. Turning on the PSU resulted in a loud pop and the smoke in the 387 was released. You never forget that smell... the smell of $300 going up in smoke

    Woofah... how much trouble did you get into afterward? I get that was a life lesson on its own, though.

    It was my own company, so I didn't get any trouble, I just had to delay the delivery of the system to the customer while I waited for a replacement 80387. That $300 (or whatever it was) was basically my total profit on that particular computer build, just up in smoke. So yeah, lesson learned: not all expensive ICs are keyed; check your orientation markers carefully.

    I remember sending the burnt-up 80387 back to the wholesaler hoping for a refund or replacement. They of course tested it and just said "your fault" (you idiot). But it was worth a shot. <shrug>
    --
    digital man (rob)

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  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Oct 30 22:14:00 2023
    I remember how hot the first Pentiums seemed. I don't recall any of my
    486es having CPU fans, only heat sinks?

    I'm not sure abuot the Pentium 1's but I don't think the P2's had fans did they? Those chips that were housed in that giant cassette tape looking thing?

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
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  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to The Lizard Master on Mon Oct 30 22:15:00 2023
    Maybe that led some folks to think of it as a DX2 as the co-processor w the second processing unit in there. Bringing back all sorts of memori now, I didn't now their origin though, thanks for sharing

    Speaking of memories, I was able to run AutoCAD on a 386SX and it wasn't t . There was a math coprocessor emulator that I would run to get past the " h coprocessor" check in the beginning.

    Likewise, I remember 3D Studio Max 1 on my DX and getting one of those
    terrible Learn to model 3D books when I was 13, spending 20 minutes trying to figure it out and going back to BBS'ing.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
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  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to Phigan on Mon Oct 30 22:17:00 2023
    I haven't gotten a chance to play with much of the Ryzen line yet, but ove years (since the 90s) I've tried several times to switch over to AMD. Each time, the computer seemed very laggy to me. Just running 'ls' in Linux, yo see how the whole thing hesitates before showing you the output. With an I CPU of the same generation, eveything always seems snappier/faster. The sa goes when it comes to stability. I hear so may good things from people abo AMDs, but I just never lucked out enough to experience them.

    Reminds me when I switched from Ubuntu to Debian. Can't say for certain
    about that aspect of it to be honest, I used linux on my servers and windows
    on my desktops but but it would be interesting to do some side by side
    testing. I'm sure you could get an AMD vs Intel virtual machine rented somewhere for a couple bucks to test

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  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Digital Man on Mon Oct 30 19:19:01 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to nelgin on Mon Oct 30 2023 05:29 pm

    really care that much. I have the lingering impression that Intel is better (than AMD) at quality control, but it's probably not a rational impression anymore.

    I used AMD for so long (continuously from about 1994 to 2011, when I started working at Intel) that I don't have any impression of quality control issues from AMD (but nor from Intel either). Between the two, I don't really care much either. I stuck with AMD for a long time because it seemed there was better bang for the buck. And a few times, I had heard AMD was measurably faster than Intel for a few generations of processors they made (I remember hearing that about their Athlon XP, one of their server processors (Opteron?), and the most recent with their Ryzen 3000 series from 2019.

    Nightfox

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  • From Unc0nnected@VERT/REALITY to Digital Man on Mon Oct 30 19:26:59 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to nelgin on Mon Oct 30 2023 05:29 pm

    I've run AMDs as long as I can remember and never had any problems running linux. Even my 486
    DX4-100 AMD chip ran Linux in its 4mb of memory booting off 2 floppy disks without issue :)

    I've gone back and forth between Intel and AMD based motherboards/CPUs over 30 years. The only
    systems that have had CPU stability issues (e.g. over-heating, tricky DRAM compatibility) were
    non-Intel systems (AMD, Cyrix). When I was working at Broadcom (16+ years), Intel was our biggest

    Interesting, I can't say for certain one way or the other but I have noticed that, particularly in server situations with 128GB+ Ram the Intel's we run have given us the biggest headaches. I run all of our office machines at stock frequencies for the most part and the AMD machines have all held together, have some 6 year old machines still running fine after being on 24/7. I imagine if they were intel's it would probably be the same story though. That being said, I setup 3 13900K machines and 2 of the CPU's I had to RMA because they were bad, so not sure about their Quality controls over there.

    These days though my issues almost always relate to the manufacturers of the motherboards first, then the PSU's second and ram third. So I'd be much more sensitive to a choice between say ASUS over MSI over ASROCK than I would AMD over Intel if I was worried about stability.
    ---
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  • From Unc0nnected@VERT/REALITY to Digital Man on Mon Oct 30 19:30:25 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to Jagossel on Mon Oct 30 2023 05:52 pm

    add an 80387 (this before there were SX or DX variants) to a 386 desktop order. I figured the
    387's pins were keyed (could only be inserted in the socket in the correct orientation) and didn't
    notice the marked corner on the chip and corresponding inidcator on the socket. Turning on the PSU
    resulted in a loud pop and the smoke in the 387 was released. You never forget that smell... the

    to the customer while I waited for a replacement 80387. That $300 (or whatever it was) was basically
    my total profit on that particular computer build, just up in smoke. So yeah, lesson learned: not
    all expensive ICs are keyed; check your orientation markers carefully.

    To quote Morpheus, "There are some things in this world that never change" because I can tell you that I had the same thing happened with a $300 Asus TUF motherboard, but for different reasons. Turned the PSU on, saw flames shoot out of one of the capacitors and then that same smell and smoke filled the room. Live and learn that while the cables might look identical, PSU cables from one model PSU, even if it's the same brand, should never be used in another.
    ---
    Synchronet .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.
  • From nelgin@VERT/EOTLBBS to Digital Man on Mon Oct 30 23:12:01 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to nelgin on Mon Oct 30 2023 17:29:30

    I've gone back and forth between Intel and AMD based motherboards/CPUs over 30 years. The only systems that have had CPU stability issues (e.g. over-heating, tricky DRAM compatibility) were non-Intel systems (AMD, Cyrix). When I was working at Broadcom (16+ years), Intel was our biggest competitor (for network controllers), so I actively boycotted Intel when spending my own money on computers. The computers I buy these days usually have Intel processors (especially the workstations), but I honestly don't really care that much. I have the lingering impression that Intel is better (than AMD) at quality control, but it's probably not a rational impression anymore.

    I've had memory fail which manifested as a CPU issue until I ran the memory test boot disk. I did have legitimate CPU issues once. When I dove under the desk to investigate, the CPU cooling fan just fell right off. Seems it vibrated itself loose over the years.

    I did like those fans that clamp down, not much fear of them falling off, but I always felt like I was putting too much pressure on the motherboard and processor. Still can't beat the old slotted PII with the built-on fan.
    ---
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to nelgin on Tue Oct 31 01:07:25 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: nelgin to Phigan on Mon Oct 30 2023 12:45 pm


    These days I have a Ryzen 5 3600 and it's quite nippy. No lag, no delay.

    I'd maybe put it down to user error or skills issue ;)

    there's no reason to be shitty about it.
    he could have a hardware issue.
    there's no skill to running a linux operating system, and certainly no
    skill in running ls at the command prompt.
    ---
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Digital Man on Tue Oct 31 01:11:00 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to nelgin on Mon Oct 30 2023 05:29 pm

    I've gone back and forth between Intel and AMD based motherboards/CPUs over 30 years. The only systems that have had CPU stability issues (e.g. over-heating, tricky DRAM compatibility) were non-Intel systems (AMD, Cyrix). When I was working at Broadcom (16+ years), Intel was our biggest competitor (for network controllers), so I actively boycotted Intel when spending my own money on computers. The computers I buy these days usually have Intel processors (especially the workstations), but I honestly don't really care that much. I have the lingering impression that Intel is better (than AMD) at quality control, but it's probably not a rational impression anymore.

    i've had both as well. for me, Intel processors just seem to have a slight speed advantage. I'm real good at noticing patterns and maybe some people are not and just don't notice. I've also had games that ran better on intel than an amd computer with more muscle. I always chalked it up to the developers catering to intel specs.
    ---
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to unc0nnected on Tue Oct 31 01:12:15 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Oct 30 2023 10:14 pm

    I'm not sure abuot the Pentium 1's but I don't think the P2's had fans did they? Those chips that were housed in that giant cassette tape looking thing?

    what?
    ---
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  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to unc0nnected on Tue Oct 31 01:13:16 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to The Lizard Master on Mon Oct 30 2023 10:15 pm

    Speaking of memories, I was able to run AutoCAD on a 386SX and it wasn't t . There was a math coprocessor emulator that I would run to get past the " h coprocessor" check in the beginning.

    Likewise, I remember 3D Studio Max 1 on my DX and getting one of those terrible Learn to model 3D books when I was 13, spending 20 minutes trying to figure it out and going back to BBS'ing.

    when i was a kid i had an atari computer and i'd spend a ton of time typing out programs just to watch some bullshit draw on the screen or play some lunar lander.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Unc0nnected on Tue Oct 31 01:15:20 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Unc0nnected to Digital Man on Mon Oct 30 2023 07:26 pm

    These days though my issues almost always relate to the manufacturers of the motherboards first, then the PSU's second and ram third. So I'd be much more sensitive to a choice between say ASUS over MSI over ASROCK than I would AMD over Intel if I was worried about stability.

    are you saying asus sucks? because i've had bad luck with asus.
    i've had a lot of laptops, etc die just after warranty and issues with mobos. ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Oct 31 09:02:51 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Unc0nnected on Mon Oct 30 2023 06:36 am

    I remember how hot the first Pentiums seemed. I don't recall any of my 486es having CPU fans, only heat sinks?

    I remember the faster 486s having fans. I had an AMD 5x86-133, which was really a 486DX4-133 and I had a heat sink with a fan on it. I thought Intel's 486DX4-100 CPUs might have had fans too, though I don't remember for sure.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to unc0nnected on Tue Oct 31 09:04:27 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to The Lizard Master on Mon Oct 30 2023 10:15 pm

    Likewise, I remember 3D Studio Max 1 on my DX and getting one of those

    I remember trying to use 3D Studio Max around 1998 or 1999 and then thinking it was more complicated than I expected, and I gave it up.. though I always thought it would be cool to know how to do 3D modeling and animation on a computer.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to MRO on Tue Oct 31 09:07:07 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Digital Man on Tue Oct 31 2023 01:11 am

    i've had both as well. for me, Intel processors just seem to have a slight speed advantage. I'm real good at noticing patterns and maybe some people are not and just don't notice. I've also had games that ran better on intel than an amd computer with more muscle. I always chalked it up to the developers catering to intel specs.

    I used just AMD for so long that I couldn't really compare. I But I always thought the games I played ran fairly well with the AMD processors I used. Even if they may have been slightly faster on Intel, I thought they were plenty fast on the AMDs.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to MRO on Tue Oct 31 09:07:39 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to unc0nnected on Tue Oct 31 2023 01:12 am

    I'm not sure abuot the Pentium 1's but I don't think the P2's had fans did
    they? Those chips that were housed in that giant cassette tape looking
    thing?

    what?

    I think he's referring to the slot-mounted Pentium 2 CPUs with the rectangular heat sinks.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Dumas Walker@VERT/CAPCITY2 to POINDEXTER FORTRAN on Tue Oct 31 10:03:00 2023
    I remember how hot the first Pentiums seemed. I don't recall any of my
    486es having CPU fans, only heat sinks?

    I skipped from the 386DX-40 to Pentiums so I am not certain. I don't think
    the few 486's I worked on had CPU fans. First I saw of them was on Pentium class machines. An old Pentium < 100 I inherited did not have one, but all
    the others I saw did.


    * SLMR 2.1a * To any objective person it'd be obvious that I'm right.

    ---
    Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Dumas Walker@VERT/CAPCITY2 to NELGIN on Tue Oct 31 10:28:00 2023
    I've run AMDs as long as I can remember and never had any problems running lin
    . Even my 486 DX4-100 AMD chip ran Linux in its 4mb of memory booting off 2 fl
    py disks without issue :)

    These days I have a Ryzen 5 3600 and it's quite nippy. No lag, no delay.

    I'd maybe put it down to user error or skills issue ;)

    Could have been an issue with a particulary distro, too. Several years
    ago, I was testing out different distros and was pretty shocked at how many (with graphical installs) would get the graphics card settings right during
    the "graphics test screen" but then I'd wind up with a desktop that was
    very much set wrong.

    OTOH, back then debian still had the non-graphic "ansi-looking" install and
    I was able to get it working without issue. I have been running debian, or
    a derivative, ever since.

    I'd not be surprised that some distros handle non-Intel CPUs better than others.


    * SLMR 2.1a * I won't use Windows, I won't use Windows, I won't....

    ---
    Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From fusion@VERT/CFBBS to Nightfox on Tue Oct 31 15:57:00 2023
    On 30 Oct 2023, Nightfox said the following...

    don't really care much either. I stuck with AMD for a long time because it seemed there was better bang for the buck. And a few times, I had heard AMD was measurably faster than Intel for a few generations of processors they made (I remember hearing that about their Athlon XP, one of their server processors (Opteron?), and the most recent with their Ryzen 3000 series from 2019.

    yeah right now the price/performance/power consumption trio is insane.. if you game at all the X3D chips in particular just stomp on the intel stuff..

    unfortunately the gen change from AM4->AM5 is still keeping the prices floating above what the 5000 series stuff was.. still a steal compared to the intel stuff though.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/25 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: cold fusion - cfbbs.net - grand rapids, mi
  • From Nopants@VERT/CITBBS to Digital Man on Tue Oct 31 10:59:00 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to nelgin on Mon Oct 30 2023 05:29 pm

    I've gone back and forth between Intel and AMD based motherboards/CPUs over 16+ years)

    I built my first AMD when the Threadripper came out. It was going to be used as a virtual machine lab system running only SSDs. I ended up booting Vmware off USB stick with a single SSD running a dedup file system so I could cram a bunch of VMs. Best server I've had. Now running Linux.


    ---
    Synchronet The Crack in Time BBS - crackintimebbs.ddns.net:2323
  • From Nopants@VERT/CITBBS to Nightfox on Tue Oct 31 11:04:00 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nightfox to Digital Man on Sun Oct 29 2023 04:58 pm

    the socket. Turning on the PSU resulted in a loud pop and the smoke in 387 was released. You never forget that smell... the smell of $300 goin up in smoke. :-(

    Ouch.. :(

    Nightfox

    Poof! Magic!


    ---
    Synchronet The Crack in Time BBS - crackintimebbs.ddns.net:2323
  • From Nopants@VERT/CITBBS to MRO on Tue Oct 31 11:17:00 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Unc0nnected on Tue Oct 31 2023 01:15 am

    are you saying asus sucks? because i've had bad luck with asus.
    i've had a lot of laptops, etc die just after warranty and issues with mobos

    I had the same issue with Asus laptops. Luckily these were just before the warranty. One had free 3 year accidental damage protection and my son spilled water on it JUST before the warranty ended. Could be they played alot of games on them that kept them running high temps for hours and fail before warranty =).

    ---
    Synchronet The Crack in Time BBS - crackintimebbs.ddns.net:2323
  • From hollowone@VERT/BEERS20 to Nightfox on Tue Oct 31 14:08:00 2023
    I remember the faster 486s having fans. I had an AMD 5x86-133, which was really a 486DX4-133 and I had a heat sink with a fan on it. I thought Intel's 486DX4-100 CPUs might have had fans too, though I don't remember for sure.

    I have the same memory. Pentium was with fan included in all computers I remember, same with 486DX2 or DX4 folks in my hood had. Basically all 486 and above seems to be targeted to include fans/heat sinks somehow. These computers where also the first to talk about over cloaking if I'm not mistaken.

    -h1

    ... Xerox Alto was the thing. Anything after we use is just a mere copy.
  • From hollowone@VERT/BEERS20 to Nightfox on Tue Oct 31 14:10:00 2023
    I remember trying to use 3D Studio Max around 1998 or 1999 and then thinking it was more complicated than I expected, and I gave it up.. though I always thought it would be cool to know how to do 3D modeling
    and animation on a computer.


    That's why when I moved to PC from Amiga, I continued to use Lightwave. much more intuitive 3d modeling and animation software than 3D studio.

    -h1

    ... Xerox Alto was the thing. Anything after we use is just a mere copy.
  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to Nightfox on Tue Oct 31 21:19:00 2023
    Likewise, I remember 3D Studio Max 1 on my DX and getting one of thos

    I remember trying to use 3D Studio Max around 1998 or 1999 and then thinki was more complicated than I expected, and I gave it up.. though I always t it would be cool to know how to do 3D modeling and animation on a comput

    Well I can tell you first hand that it's infinitely easier now with an
    infinite amount more resources if you wanted to try your hand. Although with AI on the horizon creating the 3D models by hand might go the way of the dodo before too long

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to MRO on Tue Oct 31 21:21:00 2023
    I'm not sure abuot the Pentium 1's but I don't think the P2's had fans they? Those chips that were housed in that giant cassette tape looking thing?

    what?

    These things: https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/h1oAAOSw63FZ8mmd/s-l1600.jpg

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to MRO on Tue Oct 31 21:22:00 2023
    motherboards first, then the PSU's second and ram third. So I'd be muc more sensitive to a choice between say ASUS over MSI over ASROCK than I would AMD over Intel if I was worried about stability.

    are you saying asus sucks? because i've had bad luck with asus.
    i've had a lot of laptops, etc die just after warranty and issues with

    Ah that sucks, I dunno if I would say they suck, I splurged on a $400 mobo
    this year from Asus and I think it's the best one I've ever worked with while the $300 one from the year before spurted fire like a Balrog the moment I plugged it in. Asus laptops though have treated me very well, MSI on the
    other hand not so great.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to Nightfox on Tue Oct 31 21:27:00 2023
    i've had both as well. for me, Intel processors just seem to have a slight speed advantage. I'm real good at noticing patterns and maybe people are not and just don't notice. I've also had games that ran b on intel than an amd computer with more muscle. I always chalked it u the developers catering to intel specs.

    I used just AMD for so long that I couldn't really compare. I But I alway ght the games I played ran fairly well with the AMD processors I used. Ev they may have been slightly faster on Intel, I thought they were plenty fa the AMDs.

    Intel typically would beat AMD on the gaming side, less about catering and
    more about the nature game engines being very very poorly multi-threaded(if
    you could even call them that). Unreal and Unity(pre-ECS) all bottleneck on
    a single thread called the game thread, while they have a few other threads doing things asynchronously. The end result is that clock-speed is king and while AMD will typically destroy similarly priced Intel CPU's in all multi-threaded workloads, when it comes to mostly single-threaded loads, IE Gaming, Intel will win. You'll pay a premium for it but Intel will win.

    Usually the #600x series(7600x, 5600x) offers fantastic bang for buck single-threaded performance for gaming though, really can't go wrong with
    those chips if all you want to do is game

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to Dumas Walker on Tue Oct 31 21:28:00 2023
    These days I have a Ryzen 5 3600 and it's quite nippy. No lag, no delay.
    Could have been an issue with a particulary distro, too. Several years ago, I was testing out different distros and was pretty shocked at how man (with graphical installs) would get the graphics card settings right durin the "graphics test screen" but then I'd wind up with a desktop that was very much set wrong.

    Saw exactly this when I switched from Ubuntu to Debian. I couldn't believe
    how faster and more responsive it was.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to fusion on Tue Oct 31 21:32:00 2023
    yeah right now the price/performance/power consumption trio is insane..
    if you g ame at all the X3D chips in particular just stomp on the intel stuff..
    unfortunately the gen change from AM4->AM5 is still keeping the prices floating above what the 5000 series stuff was.. still a steal compared
    to the intel stuff though.

    I use every ounce of performance these chips can offer for my work and even then I still don't see any point in buying into the AM5 line just yet. Bang for buck the 5950 is still a beast, even the 5900 or 5800 deliver more value than I can shake a stick and at and the idea of paying $700-$800 for a new 7950x versus $400 for a used 5950x for a gain of 20-30% is just silly

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Wed Nov 1 05:03:14 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nightfox to MRO on Tue Oct 31 2023 09:07 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Digital Man on Tue Oct 31 2023 01:11 am

    i've had both as well. for me, Intel processors just seem to have a slight speed advantage. I'm real good at noticing patterns and maybe some people are not and just don't notice. I've also had games that ran better on intel than an amd computer with more muscle. I always chalked it up to the developers catering to intel specs.

    I used just AMD for so long that I couldn't really compare. I But I always thought the games I played ran fairly well with the AMD processors I used. Even if they may have been slightly faster on Intel, I thought they were plenty fast on the AMDs.


    i just always remember AMD being stuff that was cheaper but not as good.
    i think for a while there they surpassed Intel, but Intel didn't allow that to happen for long. Aside from work computers I have not touched an AMD box with muscle for quit a long time.

    anyways, i'm old now and I can't really get into games. i work long hours and i rest and spend time with my god daughter. and drink.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nopants on Wed Nov 1 05:05:59 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nopants to MRO on Tue Oct 31 2023 11:17 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Unc0nnected on Tue Oct 31 2023 01:15 am

    are you saying asus sucks? because i've had bad luck with asus.
    i've had a lot of laptops, etc die just after warranty and issues with mobos

    I had the same issue with Asus laptops. Luckily these were just before the warranty. One had free 3 year accidental damage protection and my son spilled water on it JUST before the warranty ended. Could be they played alot of games on them that kept them running high temps for hours and fail before warranty =).

    I treat my stuff really good. my laptops rarely left the house. i still had issues. one time i bought 3 asus laptops from bestbuy because there was an insane sale. 2 of them had issues so i took all 3 back. Not sure if it was bestbuy's fault or not, but they went back. this is on top of my regular issues with asus.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to unc0nnected on Wed Nov 1 05:07:44 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to MRO on Tue Oct 31 2023 09:21 pm

    I'm not sure abuot the Pentium 1's but I don't think the P2's had fans they? Those chips that were housed in that giant cassette tape looking thing?

    what?

    These things: https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/h1oAAOSw63FZ8mmd/s-l1600.jpg

    oh god i never saw one of those things. funny how manufacturers were always changing and making some occasionaly stupid changes. I just had a regular p2 chip. i had a pent1, 2, and 3 that ran my bbs.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to unc0nnected on Wed Nov 1 08:15:13 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to Nightfox on Tue Oct 31 2023 09:27 pm

    Intel typically would beat AMD on the gaming side, less about catering and more about the nature game engines being very very poorly multi-threaded(if you could even call them that). Unreal and

    That's what I've heard, though I think the AMDs I used were always plenty fast.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to The Lizard Master on Tue Oct 31 06:42:00 2023
    The Lizard Master wrote to unc0nnected <=-

    Speaking of memories, I was able to run AutoCAD on a 386SX and it
    wasn't too bad. There was a math coprocessor emulator that I would run
    to get past the "no math coprocessor" check in the beginning.

    So you run software to emulate hardware running software? How
    delightfully META!


    ... Use fewer notes
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.
  • From Tracker1@VERT/TRN to Unc0nnected on Thu Nov 2 23:10:21 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Unc0nnected to Weatherman on Sun Oct 29 2023 18:29:48

    I completely forgot the 486's had a DX4 variant, I think I went from the 386DX-40 to a Pentium2 so I missed out on all of those fancy upgrades. I remember looking on with envy as I played some game on my friends Pentium-75. I can even remember the smell of those old machines like it was yesterday.

    I think those were all AMD (DX4), along with the 5x86 series... I had a 5x86@133 w/ 64mb ram, and the cache addon, it was very fast for general use, not so much for a couple of the latest games that really needed a Pentium. I think I went from that to an OC'd AMD Duron @1ghz a couple years later.

    I always go a little overkill on ram, even today running 128gb, though I have used over 70gb a couple times for project work. Part of me would like to get one of the new Macbook Pro M3 Max systems, but just can't bring myself to pay that much (2.5-3x what my desktop cost). Waiting for next gen desktop parts before doing anything new at this point.


    --
    Michael J. Ryan
    +o roughneckbbs.com
    tracker1@roughneckbbs.com

    ---
    Synchronet Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com
  • From Tracker1@VERT/TRN to Phigan on Thu Nov 2 23:20:07 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Phigan to Unc0nnected on Mon Oct 30 2023 07:51:14

    I haven't gotten a chance to play with much of the Ryzen line yet, but over the years (since the 90s) I've tried several times to switch over to AMD. Each time, the computer seemed very laggy to me. Just running 'ls' in Linux, you can see how the whole thing hesitates before showing you the output. With an Intel CPU of the same generation, eveything always seems snappier/faster. The same goes when it comes to stability. I hear so may good things from people about AMDs, but I just never lucked out enough to experience them.

    I can say that the 3000 and 5000 series have been pretty great... I upgraded from an i7 4790K to a Ryzen 500 series motherboard, using an r5 3600 until I could get a 3950X... Even the 3600 was a big boost from the 4790K, and the 16-cores in the 3950X and my current 5950X have been really great. Running Linux full time for a couple years now on my desktop and takes about all I throw at it. I will say, it was shakey for the first 4-6 months, until the next Ubuntu LTS release included updated drivers for my nic/wifi and gpu in the box. Don't get a new GPU at launch if you run linux is all I'll say. The nic/wifi were intel chips, so no diff there.

    Currently on a 5950x (16c/32t) with 128gb ddr4@3200, 2tb pcie4x4 nvme (samsung pro)... downgraded my gpu to an RX 6600 as I don't game much and drivers are very stable now. I've avoided current gen Ryzen because of memory issues, similar for intel though... I'm also not sure about big/little core performance in Linux currently. Will see what the next gen looks like.


    --
    Michael J. Ryan
    +o roughneckbbs.com
    tracker1@roughneckbbs.com

    ---
    Synchronet Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com
  • From Tracker1@VERT/TRN to unc0nnected on Thu Nov 2 23:22:34 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Oct 30 2023 22:14:00

    I'm not sure abuot the Pentium 1's but I don't think the P2's had fans did they? Those chips that were housed in that giant cassette tape looking thing?

    P2's definitely had fans and heatsyncs in the design... and it still wasn't very good at appropriate cooling iirc. I remember the server variants were just nasty hot.


    --
    Michael J. Ryan
    +o roughneckbbs.com
    tracker1@roughneckbbs.com

    ---
    Synchronet Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com
  • From Tracker1@VERT/TRN to Unc0nnected on Thu Nov 2 23:26:37 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Unc0nnected to Digital Man on Mon Oct 30 2023 19:26:59

    Interesting, I can't say for certain one way or the other but I have noticed that, particularly in server situations with 128GB+ Ram the Intel's we run have given us the biggest headaches. I run all of our office machines at stock frequencies for the most part and the AMD machines have all held together, have some 6 year old machines still

    That's cool... I put together an r5 2600 for my daughter and had to underclock the ram to 2933 or something like that or it wouldn't boot (at the labelled speed)... when I put an r7 5700 in that same board this past year it was a definite bump... haven't had any issues with 3000-5000 series on 500 series chipset boards. Skipping current 7000 series AMD because of the various DDR5 memory issues, especially with larger quantities. Hoping for a return to form next gen.


    --
    Michael J. Ryan
    +o roughneckbbs.com
    tracker1@roughneckbbs.com

    ---
    Synchronet Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com
  • From Tracker1@VERT/TRN to Unc0nnected on Thu Nov 2 23:28:56 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Unc0nnected to Digital Man on Mon Oct 30 2023 19:30:25

    To quote Morpheus, "There are some things in this world that never change" because I can tell you that I had the same thing happened with a $300 Asus TUF motherboard, but for different reasons. Turned the PSU on, saw flames shoot out of one of the capacitors and then that same smell and smoke filled the room. Live and learn that while the cables might look identical, PSU cables from one model PSU, even if it's the same brand, should never be used in another

    I'm pretty anal about keeping all the boxes, etc for computer parts inside the case box for a computer when I put it together... It's kind of wild when you sell or pass on a 6yo computer with all the parts/boxes it came with, most don't expect it.

    That said, I do wish they'd all settle on a single standard for the system side, maybe if 12vo ever takes off.


    --
    Michael J. Ryan
    +o roughneckbbs.com
    tracker1@roughneckbbs.com

    ---
    Synchronet Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com
  • From Tracker1@VERT/TRN to MRO on Thu Nov 2 23:38:09 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Wed Nov 01 2023 05:03:14

    i just always remember AMD being stuff that was cheaper but not as good.
    i think for a while there they surpassed Intel, but Intel didn't allow that to happen for long. Aside from work computers I have not touched an AMD box with muscle for quit a long time.

    For a lot of the past couple decades they have been... they started off with souped up x86 models, just as Intel released new lines. AMD's Athlon 64/XP/X2 were ahead of Intels Pentium 4 for a few years... and recently, the 3000-5000 series have been better (mostly) as well at launch.

    Right now, Intel is pouring a ton of heat and energy to keep the top slot for gaming, but even then AMD has been very competitive the past 4-5 years. Not always cheaper even. First gen ryzen had kind of crappy low end motherboards mostly, and were held back. By 3000 series, they have had really nice MB options, and been very solid. Current gen (7000) series has a few issues with high ram capacities, and running higher frequency ddr5. Next gen will likely resolve the issue(s).


    --
    Michael J. Ryan
    +o roughneckbbs.com
    tracker1@roughneckbbs.com

    ---
    Synchronet Roughneck BBS - roughneckbbs.com
  • From Weatherman@VERT/TLCBBS to Unc0nnected on Sat Nov 4 01:53:00 2023
    Unc0nnected wrote to Weatherman <=-

    I completely forgot the 486's had a DX4 variant, I think I went from
    the 386DX-40 to a Pentium2 so I missed out on all of those fancy
    upgrades. I remember looking on with envy as I played some game on my friends Pentium-75. I can even remember the smell of those old
    machines like it was yesterday. ---

    Heh, now that's funny. I never ran a Pentium lower than a P-II myself. Back in the days of the original Pentium chips when I was running my DX4 I used to tease the early adopters of the Pentium by telling them that MY chip could actually do simple addition.


    ... 2 + 2 = 5 for extremely large values of 2.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.49
    Synchronet The Lost Chord BBS - Cheyenne, WY
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Tracker1 on Sat Nov 4 08:00:25 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Tracker1 to unc0nnected on Thu Nov 02 2023 11:22 pm

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Oct 30 2023 22:14:00

    I'm not sure abuot the Pentium 1's but I don't think the P2's had fans did they? Those chips that were housed in that giant cassette tape looking thing?

    P2's definitely had fans and heatsyncs in the design... and it still wasn't very good at appropriate cooling iirc. I remember the server variants were just nasty hot.


    my friend took off the heatsink and fan and said the chip is real cool and told his friend to touch it. his fingerprint was burned onto the chip. i had that chip for many years.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Tracker1 on Sat Nov 4 10:21:00 2023
    Tracker1 wrote to Unc0nnected <=-

    I always go a little overkill on ram, even today running 128gb, though
    I have used over 70gb a couple times for project work. Part of me
    would like to get one of the new Macbook Pro M3 Max systems, but just can't bring myself to pay that much (2.5-3x what my desktop cost).
    Waiting for next gen desktop parts before doing anything new at this point.

    I'm a big fan of the "buy a 3 year old off-lease Dell desktop every
    couple of years" strategy. So many desktops get leased by Corporate
    America and turned in after a relatively tame lifespan that they're
    relatively cheap in the secondary market.

    I replaced a Dell i7-4790 desktop with a 10th gen i7 with 64GB of RAM.
    I could have gotten more life out of the older desktop, but I wanted
    more USB 3.0 ports , NVMe and to support > 16gb of RAM. That was the
    first system I've bought that I didn't keep going for 5+ years.

    Bah, it bugs me that I have a perfectly good system in my closet doing
    nothing. Part of me wants to turn it into a hackintosh, or run a desktop
    linux on it or something...


    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.
  • From Dumas Walker@VERT/CAPCITY2 to TRACKER1 on Sat Nov 4 08:33:00 2023
    I think those were all AMD (DX4), along with the 5x86 series... I had a 5x86@1
    w/ 64mb ram, and the cache addon, it was very fast for general use, not so mu
    for a couple of the latest games that really needed a Pentium. I think I wen
    from that to an OC'd AMD Duron @1ghz a couple years later.

    I *think* Cyrix also had a 5x86 (or something like that).


    * SLMR 2.1a * On your turf again, and using fake taglines!

    ---
    Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From The Lizard Master@VERT/NITEEYES to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Nov 4 12:35:48 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to The Lizard Master on Tue Oct 31 2023 06:42 am

    Speaking of memories, I was able to run AutoCAD on a 386SX and it wasn't too bad. There was a math coprocessor emulator that I would run to get past the "no math coprocessor" check in the beginning.

    So you run software to emulate hardware running software? How
    delightfully META!

    Couldn't be any more META lol, none more meta.

    ---
    Synchronet This is my tagline so I don't get any complaints when I post
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Tracker1 on Sat Nov 4 17:53:51 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Tracker1 to Unc0nnected on Thu Nov 02 2023 11:10 pm

    I always go a little overkill on ram, even today running 128gb, though I have used over 70gb a couple times for project work. Part of me would

    I started using 32GB of RAM in 2012, when I think it was a bit overkill. These days, I think 32GB is more common, though 16GB is probably a common minimum. Currently I still have 32GB in my main desktop PC at home, though I currently have 64GB in my BBS computer - I also have a Plex media server running on that, and I wanted it to be able to handle my BBS as well as multiple media streams etc. if needed.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Weatherman on Sat Nov 4 17:57:10 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Weatherman to Unc0nnected on Sat Nov 04 2023 01:53 am

    Heh, now that's funny. I never ran a Pentium lower than a P-II myself. Back in the days of the original Pentium chips when I was running my DX4 I used to tease the early adopters of the Pentium by telling them that MY chip could actually do simple addition.

    I think Intel fixed that Pentium floating point flaw fairly quickly after it was discovered (and I'd heard it only happened in a rare corner case anyway).

    At that time I was only using AMD processors. I went from an AMD 386DX-40 to an AMD 5x86-133, then AMD K6 200mhz, K6-2 300mhz, and K6-3 450mhz (I think), then the Athlons..

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to The Lizard Master on Sat Nov 4 17:57:55 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: The Lizard Master to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Nov 04 2023 12:35 pm

    Couldn't be any more META lol, none more meta.

    I like the Spinal Tap reference. :)

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Phigan@VERT/TACOPRON to Tracker1 on Sun Nov 5 06:34:52 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Tracker1 to Phigan on Thu Nov 02 2023 11:20 pm

    box. Don't get a new GPU at launch if you run linux is all I'll say. The

    Good advice :)

    Which Ubuntu release were you talking about? 22.04?

    ---
    Synchronet TIRED of waiting 2 hours for a taco? GO TO TACOPRONTO.bbs.io
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nightfox on Sun Nov 5 08:34:00 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nightfox to Tracker1 on Sat Nov 04 2023 05:53 pm

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Tracker1 to Unc0nnected on Thu Nov 02 2023 11:10 pm

    I always go a little overkill on ram, even today running 128gb, though I have used over 70gb a couple times for project work. Part of me would

    I started using 32GB of RAM in 2012, when I think it was a bit overkill. These days, I think 32GB is more common, though 16GB is probably a common minimum. Currently I still have 32GB in my main desktop PC at home, though I currently have 64GB in my BBS computer - I also have a Plex media server running on that, and I wanted it to be able to handle my BBS as well as

    i still hae 16 gigs in my main computer. i run a plex server and stream to other computers on the network. i can play newer games.
    i havent really hit a wall yet. just the other day i re-encoded a movie
    and replaced the audio and it didn't take long.
    i'm not a big gamer though. if i needed more i would buy it.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to MRO on Sun Nov 5 13:10:00 2023
    fans they? Those chips that were housed in that giant cassette looking thing?

    what?

    These things: https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/h1oAAOSw63FZ8mmd/s-l1600.j

    oh god i never saw one of those things. funny how manufacturers were always changing and making some occasionaly stupid changes. I just had
    a regular p2 chip. i had a pent1, 2, and 3 that ran my bbs.

    And this whole time I thought those were the 'regular' Pentium 2's :)

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to unc0nnected on Sun Nov 5 18:27:06 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to MRO on Sun Nov 05 2023 01:10 pm

    fans they? Those chips that were housed in that giant cassette looking thing?

    what?

    These things: https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/h1oAAOSw63FZ8mmd/s-l1600.j

    oh god i never saw one of those things. funny how manufacturers were always changing and making some occasionaly stupid changes. I just had a regular p2 chip. i had a pent1, 2, and 3 that ran my bbs.

    And this whole time I thought those were the 'regular' Pentium 2's :)

    well like i said, i got that big haul of old computers from my uncle in the late 90s. they couldnt work out a single way to do things. rj11 jacks for keyboards and other stuff. parallel port adapters for serial ports for mouse, huge fans. weird plastic enclosures inside the cases. engineers were out of control.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Nightfox on Mon Nov 6 06:26:00 2023
    Nightfox wrote to The Lizard Master <=-

    I like the Spinal Tap reference. :)

    come to think of it, I'm surprised Teslas don't have a guage that goes
    to 11.



    ... Imagine the music as a set of disconnected events
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to MRO on Mon Nov 6 06:28:00 2023
    MRO wrote to unc0nnected <=-

    well like i said, i got that big haul of old computers from my uncle in the late 90s. they couldnt work out a single way to do things. rj11 jacks for keyboards and other stuff. parallel port adapters for serial ports for mouse, huge fans. weird plastic enclosures inside the cases.
    engineers were out of control.

    AND THE CASES!

    Compaq desktops with flying butresses! HPs with hidden optical drives.
    CD-ROM holders built-in to the cases! The Packard Bell "Corner PC"!
    Monitors with built-in speakers. Matching weird mice and keyboards!

    Good times.



    ... Imagine the music as a set of disconnected events
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.
  • From unc0nnected@VERT/BTTMLSS to MRO on Mon Nov 6 20:00:00 2023
    well like i said, i got that big haul of old computers from my uncle in the late 90s. they couldnt work out a single way to do things. rj11 jacks for keyboard s and other stuff. parallel port adapters for serial ports for mouse, huge fans . weird plasti

    Well said, it's so easy to take for granted how standardized everything is today and that it wasn't that long ago when everyone was going off in their
    own directions with what they thought was the best way. I mean hell, wasn't
    it only in the last 2-3 years that Apple finally got on USB-C?

    I can't even imagine how excited you must have been with that haul? I can almost smell it if I close my eyes and that smell alone would be enough to
    give me goosebumps.

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Linux/64)
    * Origin: The Bottomless Abyss BBS * bbs.bottomlessabyss.net
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Nov 6 18:06:10 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox on Mon Nov 06 2023 06:26 am

    I like the Spinal Tap reference. :)

    come to think of it, I'm surprised Teslas don't have a guage that goes to 11.

    I've seen articles that show Teslas (maybe just the Model S?) have a mode where if you're going fast enough, the screen will show a plaid sequence like in Spaceballs.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Nov 6 18:08:01 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to MRO on Mon Nov 06 2023 06:28 am

    AND THE CASES!

    Compaq desktops with flying butresses! HPs with hidden optical drives. CD-ROM holders built-in to the cases! The Packard Bell "Corner PC"! Monitors with built-in speakers. Matching weird mice and keyboards!

    I often thought the major computer manufacturers did non-standard stuff like that to encourage customers to buy accessories from them, that fit their cases & so forth.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to unc0nnected on Mon Nov 6 18:12:43 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to MRO on Mon Nov 06 2023 08:00 pm

    well like i said, i got that big haul of old computers from my uncle in
    the late 90s. they couldnt work out a single way to do things. rj11

    Well said, it's so easy to take for granted how standardized everything is today and that it wasn't that long ago when everyone was going off in their own directions with what they thought was the best way. I mean hell, wasn't it only in the last 2-3 years that Apple finally got on USB-C?

    In the 90s, if you built your own PC, I thought PC parts were fairly well standardized (especially when the ATX standard came along). It was mainly the big computer makers that were doing non-standard things with the PCs they made. Apple has always done their own thing.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Nov 6 23:24:09 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to MRO on Mon Nov 06 2023 06:28 am

    MRO wrote to unc0nnected <=-

    well like i said, i got that big haul of old computers from my uncle in the late 90s. they couldnt work out a single way to do things. rj11 jacks for keyboards and other stuff. parallel port adapters for serial ports for mouse, huge fans. weird plastic enclosures inside the cases.
    engineers were out of control.

    AND THE CASES!

    Compaq desktops with flying butresses! HPs with hidden optical drives. CD-ROM holders built-in to the cases! The Packard Bell "Corner PC"!
    Monitors with built-in speakers. Matching weird mice and keyboards!

    oh yeah. my friend worked at a pc repair store. there was a cavity in the front that you had to shove your arm into to pull a switch to get the case to split into 2 so you could access everything.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to unc0nnected on Mon Nov 6 23:24:51 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: unc0nnected to MRO on Mon Nov 06 2023 08:00 pm

    today and that it wasn't that long ago when everyone was going off in their own directions with what they thought was the best way. I mean hell, wasn't it only in the last 2-3 years that Apple finally got on USB-C?

    I can't even imagine how excited you must have been with that haul? I can almost smell it if I close my eyes and that smell alone would be enough to give me goosebumps.

    i tore through it and kept the good stuff. i was a moron though. i tossed a lot of model m keyboards. i kept the best ones for myself.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Boraxman@VERT/MSRDBBS to MRO on Tue Nov 7 17:11:50 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Nightfox on Sun Nov 05 2023 08:34 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nightfox to Tracker1 on Sat Nov 04 2023 05:53 pm

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Tracker1 to Unc0nnected on Thu Nov 02 2023 11:10 pm

    I always go a little overkill on ram, even today running 128gb, thou I have used over 70gb a couple times for project work. Part of me would

    I started using 32GB of RAM in 2012, when I think it was a bit overkill. These days, I think 32GB is more common, though 16GB is probably a common minimum. Currently I still have 32GB in my main desktop PC at home, thoug currently have 64GB in my BBS computer - I also have a Plex media server running on that, and I wanted it to be able to handle my BBS as well as

    i still hae 16 gigs in my main computer. i run a plex server and stream to other computers on the network. i can play newer games.
    i havent really hit a wall yet. just the other day i re-encoded a movie
    and replaced the audio and it didn't take long.
    i'm not a big gamer though. if i needed more i would buy it.

    I'm still on 8GB on my main computer, which was built back in 2009. Been thinking of upgrading the RAM but I rarely use the full 8GB. Needless to say I don't run memory hungry games and apps...

    ---
    Synchronet MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to MRO on Tue Nov 7 06:47:00 2023
    MRO wrote to unc0nnected <=-

    i tore through it and kept the good stuff. i was a moron though. i
    tossed a lot of model m keyboards. i kept the best ones for myself.

    I started a job in 2017, the CIO told me with some pride that he did a
    cleanup after my predecessor left the job. He sent "pallets" of IBM ATs,
    PS/2s and IBM VGA monitors, model M keyboards and those weird metal ball mice[1] to e-waste, probably paid them to take it away, too.

    I wept silently.

    In the corner, they had one working PS/2 model 80, 8514 monitor, mouse
    and model M keyboard. It was running OS/2 1.3 with a tape drive. They
    used it to do restores from their one remaining AS/400.

    I sat down at it and played around for a while. It was almost the exact
    system I'd started my IT career on almost 30 years earlier.




    [1] "Metal Ball Mice" sounds like an anime title, now that I wrote it.



    ... Change nothing and continue consistently
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Boraxman on Tue Nov 7 06:53:00 2023
    Boraxman wrote to MRO <=-

    I'm still on 8GB on my main computer, which was built back in 2009.
    Been thinking of upgrading the RAM but I rarely use the full 8GB.
    Needless to say I don't run memory hungry games and apps...

    I overthink memory some times. I have an old Thinkpad T410 that only
    supports 8 GB of RAM. It's not a daily driver, I use it when I go to
    coffee shops and such. Running a web browser with a couple of tabs
    open, winamp, and an office app or two does just about does it in - but
    that's OK.

    I just upgraded a desktop with 16GB of RAM, thinking of future
    upgrades, and feel bad - 16GB felt like just enough memory. It's
    sitting in my closet gathering dust now.




    ... Change nothing and continue consistently
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.
  • From Dumas Walker@VERT/CAPCITY2 to POINDEXTER FORTRAN on Tue Nov 7 09:25:00 2023
    AND THE CASES!

    Compaq desktops with flying butresses! HPs with hidden optical drives.
    CD-ROM holders built-in to the cases! The Packard Bell "Corner PC"!
    Monitors with built-in speakers. Matching weird mice and keyboards!

    Back in 1994 I was working for a consulting firm. We had some smaller
    clients where we did some hardware work (installing modems, extra cards or
    HDs, etc.). We had one client that had one of those Compaq PCs that was all
    in one like an Apple, with everything built into an oversized monitor case.

    Trying to get anything installed into that case was difficult. ;)


    * SLMR 2.1a * litterate: (adj.) Able to write, but only writes garbage.

    ---
    Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Nopants@VERT/CITBBS to MRO on Tue Nov 7 10:44:00 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to unc0nnected on Mon Nov 06 2023 11:24 pm

    i tore through it and kept the good stuff. i was a moron though. i tossed a >lot of model m keyboards. i kept the best ones for myself.

    One of my favorite keyboards!

    I just got a replacement cable for my Model M13. You can get alot of money for these. What did you say you were again?


    ---
    Synchronet The Crack in Time BBS - crackintimebbs.ddns.net:2323
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nopants on Wed Nov 8 03:07:17 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nopants to MRO on Tue Nov 07 2023 10:44 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to unc0nnected on Mon Nov 06 2023 11:24 pm

    i tore through it and kept the good stuff. i was a moron though. i tossed a >lot of model m keyboards. i kept the best ones for myself.

    One of my favorite keyboards!

    I just got a replacement cable for my Model M13. You can get alot of money for these. What did you say you were again?

    did you mean WHERE?

    I don't have any of those keyboards. i don't keep stuff i'm not using around. i'm anti hoarder.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Nopants@VERT/CITBBS to MRO on Wed Nov 8 17:44:00 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Nopants on Wed Nov 08 2023 03:07 am

    I don't have any of those keyboards. i don't keep stuff i'm not using around i'm anti hoarder.

    I hope your turned them into some loot and not be a moron is all

    The IBM Model M13 has the thinkpad trackpoint mouse built in great for a
    server
    https://i.imgur.com/rRQeVSi.jpeg


    ---
    Synchronet The Crack in Time BBS - crackintimebbs.ddns.net:2323
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Nopants on Thu Nov 9 04:24:48 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nopants to MRO on Wed Nov 08 2023 05:44 pm

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Nopants on Wed Nov 08 2023 03:07 am

    I don't have any of those keyboards. i don't keep stuff i'm not using around i'm anti hoarder.

    I hope your turned them into some loot and not be a moron is all

    no, i just tossed them out. it was the late 90s and they weren't really in any demand.

    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Ogg@VERT/CAPCITY2 to Nopants on Thu Nov 9 07:56:00 2023
    Hello Nopants!

    ** On Wednesday 08.11.23 - 17:44, Nopants wrote to MRO:

    The IBM Model M13 has the thinkpad trackpoint mouse built in great for a server
    https://i.imgur.com/rRQeVSi.jpeg

    Did't know such a thing existed.

    Personally, I've never used the trackpoint on my various
    Thinkpads at all. Using the trackpoint to navigate tended to
    overshoot the target. I like the definitive L-R buttons on my
    pcs though.

    --- OpenXP 5.0.57
    * Origin: Ogg's Dovenet Point (723:320/1.9)
    Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From Boraxman@VERT/MSRDBBS to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Nov 13 17:48:45 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Boraxman on Tue Nov 07 2023 06:53 am

    I overthink memory some times. I have an old Thinkpad T410 that only
    supports 8 GB of RAM. It's not a daily driver, I use it when I go to
    coffee shops and such. Running a web browser with a couple of tabs
    open, winamp, and an office app or two does just about does it in - but
    that's OK.

    I just upgraded a desktop with 16GB of RAM, thinking of future
    upgrades, and feel bad - 16GB felt like just enough memory. It's
    sitting in my closet gathering dust now.

    When I think of how much memory computers have, and how much programs use,
    I'm impressed by how things have progressed, and saddened at the same time by how wasteful we are. The dismay of bloat ends up being the dominant feeling.

    Improvements in hardware have an equal and opposite reaction, they result in a degradation in efficiency.

    ---
    Synchronet MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org
  • From Weatherman@VERT/TLCBBS to Nightfox on Mon Nov 13 02:24:00 2023
    Nightfox wrote to Weatherman <=-

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Weatherman to Unc0nnected on Sat Nov 04 2023 01:53 am

    Heh, now that's funny. I never ran a Pentium lower than a P-II myself. Back in the days of the original Pentium chips when I was running my DX4 I used to tease the early adopters of the Pentium by telling them that MY chip could actually do simple addition.

    I think Intel fixed that Pentium floating point flaw fairly quickly
    after it was discovered (and I'd heard it only happened in a rare
    corner case anyway).

    At that time I was only using AMD processors. I went from an AMD
    386DX-40 to an AMD 5x86-133, then AMD K6 200mhz, K6-2 300mhz, and K6-3 450mhz (I think), then the Athlons..

    = Synchronet = Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com

    Yeah, they acted pretty quickly on that - had to, too many of the damned chips out there to just let it go. All the same, sure was fun to tease the Pentium users about it. I went from the 486DX4 to the K6 myself and have only built with AMD chips ever since. Have plenty of Intel bases machines around here but in general they're yardsale finds. My work computer is Intel based but that was furnished by my employer (Dell) so I didn't get much say in what they sent me.


    ... Got my tie caught in the fax... Suddenly I was in L.A.
    --- MultiMail/Linux v0.49
    Synchronet The Lost Chord BBS - Cheyenne, WY
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Boraxman on Mon Nov 13 06:34:45 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Boraxman to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Nov 13 2023 05:48 pm

    When I think of how much memory computers have, and how much programs use, I'm impressed by how things have progressed, and saddened at the same time by how wasteful we are. The dismay of bloat ends up being the dominant feeling.


    yeah there's some programs that i'm running that use wAAAAAY too much memory. especially my browsers. i have opera and chrome open and they're using 1.5gigs of memory.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From fusion@VERT/CFBBS to Boraxman on Mon Nov 13 19:56:00 2023
    On 13 Nov 2023, Boraxman said the following...

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Boraxman on Tue Nov 07 2023 06:53 am

    I just upgraded a desktop with 16GB of RAM, thinking of future
    upgrades, and feel bad - 16GB felt like just enough memory. It's
    sitting in my closet gathering dust now.

    When I think of how much memory computers have, and how much programs
    use, I'm impressed by how things have progressed, and saddened at the
    same time by how wasteful we are. The dismay of bloat ends up being the dominant feeling.

    for most people 16gb is currently fine, and up until a few years ago that was 8gb.. gaming, browsing, whatever really. time marches on..

    but if you start to use your machine like a workstation all bets are off :) running multiple VMs, running AI locally, probably video editing, and also video game streaming is eking it's way into this category.

    using Stable Diffusion here i'll sometimes see 27GB or so conventional ram, and it chews up 16GB of VRAM like it's nothing.

    apparently this is what SDXL thinks DM looks like with some new Sync merch: http://kirin.dcclost.com/~alex/00007-3501872545.png

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/25 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: cold fusion - cfbbs.net - grand rapids, mi
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to fusion on Tue Nov 14 02:49:20 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: fusion to Boraxman on Mon Nov 13 2023 07:56 pm


    apparently this is what SDXL thinks DM looks like with some new Sync merch: http://kirin.dcclost.com/~alex/00007-3501872545.png

    EWWW
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to all on Tue Nov 14 03:01:45 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to fusion on Tue Nov 14 2023 02:49 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: fusion to Boraxman on Mon Nov 13 2023 07:56 pm


    apparently this is what SDXL thinks DM looks like with some new Sync merch: http://kirin.dcclost.com/~alex/00007-3501872545.png

    EWWW

    here is mine https://i.imgur.com/bde8KW8.jpg
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Digital Man@VERT to MRO on Tue Nov 14 11:24:26 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to fusion on Tue Nov 14 2023 02:49 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: fusion to Boraxman on Mon Nov 13 2023 07:56 pm


    apparently this is what SDXL thinks DM looks like with some new Sync merch: http://kirin.dcclost.com/~alex/00007-3501872545.png

    EWWW

    Doesn't look anything like me!?! (or does it?)
    --
    digital man (rob)

    Sling Blade quote #11:
    Doyle Hargraves (to Karl): What in the hell you doin' with that hammer?
    Norco, CA WX: 79.3F, 24.0% humidity, 0 mph ENE wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs ---
    Synchronet Vertrauen Home of Synchronet [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Digital Man on Wed Nov 15 02:35:03 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to MRO on Tue Nov 14 2023 11:24 am

    apparently this is what SDXL thinks DM looks like with some new Sync merch: http://kirin.dcclost.com/~alex/00007-3501872545.png

    EWWW

    Doesn't look anything like me!?! (or does it?)

    it's an older white dude, that's about it.
    i think this ai code is kinda screwed up. I've tried a few things.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Boraxman@VERT/MSRDBBS to MRO on Wed Nov 15 23:06:10 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Boraxman on Mon Nov 13 2023 06:34 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Boraxman to poindexter FORTRAN on Mon Nov 13 2023 05:48 pm

    When I think of how much memory computers have, and how much programs use I'm impressed by how things have progressed, and saddened at the same tim by how wasteful we are. The dismay of bloat ends up being the dominant feeling.


    yeah there's some programs that i'm running that use wAAAAAY too much memory especially my browsers. i have opera and chrome open and they're using 1.5g of memory.

    Well, browsers are at another level. The web is now a dismail failure, utterly broken. Browsers are horrendous because web-devs have made the web horrendous.


    You remember that episode of The Simpsons where Homer meets his long lost half-brother Herb, who owns a car company? Herb gets Homer to design a car and Homer ends up designing a monstrosity that sends Herb bust. The web is that car.

    ---
    Synchronet MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org
  • From Boraxman@VERT/MSRDBBS to fusion on Wed Nov 15 23:09:04 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: fusion to Boraxman on Mon Nov 13 2023 07:56 pm

    for most people 16gb is currently fine, and up until a few years ago that wa 8gb.. gaming, browsing, whatever really. time marches on..

    but if you start to use your machine like a workstation all bets are off :) running multiple VMs, running AI locally, probably video editing, and also video game streaming is eking it's way into this category.

    using Stable Diffusion here i'll sometimes see 27GB or so conventional ram, it chews up 16GB of VRAM like it's nothing.

    apparently this is what SDXL thinks DM looks like with some new Sync merch:
    Oh,I don't run that stuff. Maybe a VM every now and then, but ONLY to buil software for a diferent architecture, or perhaps occasionally test something. It's quite rare.

    Most of the time I'm running Mutt, or some CLI program, Brave would be the most 'heavy' program I run, occasionally Spotify which is bloated. So for me 8G is enough.

    ---
    Synchronet MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Boraxman on Wed Nov 15 11:14:07 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Boraxman to MRO on Wed Nov 15 2023 11:06 pm


    You remember that episode of The Simpsons where Homer meets his long lost half-brother Herb, who owns a car company? Herb gets Homer to design a car and Homer ends up designing a monstrosity that sends Herb bust. The web is that car.

    hey atleast we dont have flash anymore.
    and java is usually just on phones.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Boraxman on Wed Nov 15 11:14:53 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Boraxman to fusion on Wed Nov 15 2023 11:09 pm


    Most of the time I'm running Mutt, or some CLI program, Brave would be the most 'heavy' program I run, occasionally Spotify which is bloated. So for me 8G is enough.

    good thing about brave is it blocks youtube ads. now it's difficult on regular browsers to defeat their ads.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Nightfox@VERT/DIGDIST to Boraxman on Wed Nov 15 13:25:08 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Boraxman to MRO on Wed Nov 15 2023 11:06 pm

    Well, browsers are at another level. The web is now a dismail failure, utterly broken. Browsers are horrendous because web-devs have made the web horrendous.

    You remember that episode of The Simpsons where Homer meets his long lost half-brother Herb, who owns a car company? Herb gets Homer to design a car and Homer ends up designing a monstrosity that sends Herb bust. The web is that car.

    The web is used by millions of people around the world every day (via a web browser or apps making REST calls & such via web erquests), so I'm not sure I'd say it's such a failure.

    Nightfox

    ---
    Synchronet Digital Distortion: digitaldistortionbbs.com
  • From Arelor@VERT/PALANTIR to MRO on Wed Nov 15 16:50:00 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to Boraxman on Wed Nov 15 2023 11:14 am

    good thing about brave is it blocks youtube ads. now it's difficult on regu
    I have found Clipious (through Invidious instances) to be quite ok. It is sanerthan using a browser when it works. I think Google is removing them from searchresults :-)

    --
    gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

    ---
    Synchronet Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From fusion@VERT/CFBBS to MRO on Wed Nov 15 18:56:00 2023
    On 15 Nov 2023, MRO said the following...

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Boraxman to fusion on Wed Nov 15 2023 11:09 pm


    Most of the time I'm running Mutt, or some CLI program, Brave would be most 'heavy' program I run, occasionally Spotify which is bloated. So me 8G is enough.

    good thing about brave is it blocks youtube ads. now it's difficult on regular browsers to defeat their ads.

    it's actually incredibly simple. firefox+ublock origin

    over this whole ordeal i've seen their anti-ad-blocker message like 3 times. then i go into ublock's settings and update the filters and it's gone. about 10 seconds of effort total over the whole "ordeal"

    --- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/12/25 (Windows/32)
    * Origin: cold fusion - cfbbs.net - grand rapids, mi
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to fusion on Thu Nov 16 04:14:39 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: fusion to MRO on Wed Nov 15 2023 06:56 pm

    good thing about brave is it blocks youtube ads. now it's difficult on regular browsers to defeat their ads.

    it's actually incredibly simple. firefox+ublock origin

    over this whole ordeal i've seen their anti-ad-blocker message like 3 times. then i go into ublock's settings and update the filters and it's gone. about 10 seconds of effort total over the whole "ordeal"

    well i've got chrome and ublock origin and i've updated the filters like people suggest. it was still screwing up for me.

    i'm not so sure that's the case anymore because i guess on my desktop it is now filtering the ads and youtube isnt filtering it. yep i've bounced around to starting 10 other vids and it's not catching it anymore.

    i dont watch youtube much on my desktop. i only have it play on my phone while i'm doing other things.

    I'm not a fan of firefox anymore because in the past I had issues with memory holes.

    I'm not a fan of video ads. I guess they make money off of it. i'd prefer to have a silent ad with CC appear on the right side and play along or something.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Dumas Walker@VERT/CAPCITY2 to BORAXMAN on Thu Nov 16 11:22:00 2023
    You remember that episode of The Simpsons where Homer meets his long lost half-brother Herb, who owns a car company? Herb gets Homer to design a car an
    Homer ends up designing a monstrosity that sends Herb bust. The web is that car.

    That is an awesome analogy. :)


    * SLMR 2.1a * It's time for the Possum Lodge Word Game!!!

    ---
    Synchronet CAPCITY2 * capcity2.synchro.net * Telnet/SSH:2022/Rlogin/HTTP
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Boraxman on Thu Nov 16 17:44:40 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Boraxman to MRO on Wed Nov 15 2023 11:06 pm

    Well, browsers are at another level. The web is now a dismail failure, utterly broken. Browsers are horrendous because web-devs have made the web horrendous.

    I'm intrigued by Gemini and Gopher protocols, but I like plain old HTML. I'd like to see a simple browser that works with basic HTML get some traction, myself. I think back to the blogs I hand-hacked back before blogger.


    Kmeleon loads my tilde blog (https://tilde.club/~poindexter) in around 100 megabytes of RAM just fine, and to me, HTML is easier to hand-code than Gemini or Gopher.

    ...Have you ever asked a question you weren't supposed to ask?
    ---
    Synchronet .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.
  • From Neoshock@VERT/VINTAGE to Bulifyf on Sat Nov 18 20:58:31 2023
    Re: Hey folks
    By: Bulifyf to All on Tue Oct 24 2023 08:35 pm

    Welcome back to the past.
    I too am from Canada, in the Vancouver area!

    ---
    Synchronet Vintage Pi BBS - vintagepi.asuscomm.com
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Neoshock on Sun Nov 19 07:02:10 2023
    Re: Hey folks
    By: Neoshock to Bulifyf on Sat Nov 18 2023 08:58 pm

    Re: Hey folks
    By: Bulifyf to All on Tue Oct 24 2023 08:35 pm

    Welcome back to the past.
    I too am from Canada, in the Vancouver area!

    sorry for your loss!
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Arelor@VERT/PALANTIR to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Nov 23 12:13:12 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Boraxman on Thu Nov 16 2023 05:44 pm

    I'm intrigued by Gemini and Gopher protocols, but I like plain old HTML. I'd
    You can serve HTML pages over Gopher. You could build a gophersite on HTML only. People just prefers not to do it because gophr has better ways of arranging content-

    --
    gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

    ---
    Synchronet Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Boraxman@VERT/MSRDBBS to Nightfox on Fri Nov 24 19:44:32 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Nightfox to Boraxman on Wed Nov 15 2023 01:25 pm

    The web is used by millions of people around the world every day (via a web browser or apps making REST calls & such via web erquests), so I'm not sure say it's such a failure.

    Nightfox

    It's used by many people yes, but it is a mess nonetheless. There seems to be a movement to use old Web 1 technology, go back to older federated systems instead of controlled bloated platforms.

    ---
    Synchronet MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org
  • From Boraxman@VERT/MSRDBBS to poindexter FORTRAN on Fri Nov 24 19:48:21 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Boraxman on Thu Nov 16 2023 05:44 pm

    I'm intrigued by Gemini and Gopher protocols, but I like plain old HTML. I'd like to see a simple browser that works with basic HTML get some traction, myself. I think back to the blogs I hand-hacked back before blogger.


    Kmeleon loads my tilde blog (https://tilde.club/~poindexter) in around 100 megabytes of RAM just fine, and to me, HTML is easier to hand-code than Gemi or Gopher.

    ...Have you ever asked a question you weren't supposed to ask?

    I've played with both. Gemini is relatively new, but I find it a little too restrictive in terms of format. Geminispace is small and seems a little bit list a small community of people who's common interest is just Gemini and "smol" web.

    The key is to
    eschew bloat and show people the web can be fast, simple, friendly and fun again.

    ---
    Synchronet MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org
  • From poindexter FORTRAN@VERT/REALITY to Boraxman on Sun Nov 26 21:05:00 2023
    Boraxman wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    The key is to
    eschew bloat and show people the web can be fast, simple, friendly and
    fun again.

    I'm rediscovering simple blogging. I'm running Blosxom on http://tilde.club/~poindexter and found there are a bunch of tools to
    take plain text and make it into a somewhat pretty blog - even one
    written completely in BASH!



    ... Do you have access to your previous configuration?
    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    Synchronet .: realitycheckbbs.org :: scientia potentia est :.
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Nov 28 05:01:02 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Boraxman on Sun Nov 26 2023 09:05 pm

    Boraxman wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    The key is to
    eschew bloat and show people the web can be fast, simple, friendly and fun again.

    I'm rediscovering simple blogging. I'm running Blosxom on http://tilde.club/~poindexter and found there are a bunch of tools to
    take plain text and make it into a somewhat pretty blog - even one
    written completely in BASH!


    i never liked blogs. most people were boring.
    now most blogs are just advertisements thinly diguised as blogs.

    it reminds me about when everyone was trying to do podcasts. most people
    just arent interesting enough.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Nov 28 05:14:09 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Nov 28 2023 05:01 am

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Boraxman on Sun Nov 26 2023 09:05 pm

    Boraxman wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

    The key is to
    eschew bloat and show people the web can be fast, simple, friendly and fun again.

    I'm rediscovering simple blogging. I'm running Blosxom on http://tilde.club/~poindexter and found there are a bunch of tools to

    btw, i loaded it up.

    are you aware that your color scheme is shit?
    https://i.imgur.com/UXukgTU.png
    why would you choose light gray text on white?
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Boraxman@VERT/MSRDBBS to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Nov 28 21:44:57 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: poindexter FORTRAN to Boraxman on Sun Nov 26 2023 09:05 pm

    I'm rediscovering simple blogging. I'm running Blosxom on http://tilde.club/~poindexter and found there are a bunch of tools to
    take plain text and make it into a somewhat pretty blog - even one
    written completely in BASH!

    I've created a website, but decided against blogging. Blogging is fine when it is personal, but I've seen people who post articles as blog posts, which doesn't make sense. Articles and writing which aren't a log would be better served categorised, tagged and sorted.

    ---
    Synchronet MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org
  • From Arelor@VERT/PALANTIR to Boraxman on Tue Nov 28 08:41:57 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Boraxman to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Nov 28 2023 09:44 pm

    I've created a website, but decided against blogging. Blogging is fine when > is personal, but I've seen people who post articles as blog posts, which
    doesn't make sense. Articles and writing which aren't a log would be better > served categorised, tagged and sorted.


    The blog format only works for news sites, opinion sites for current events, and project status sites (which are just speciallized news, if you ask me).

    There are writers publishing fiction in blog form, but I think the format does not work well.

    --
    gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

    ---
    Synchronet Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL
  • From Digital Man@VERT to MRO on Fri Dec 1 12:20:29 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Nov 28 2023 05:01 am

    it reminds me about when everyone was trying to do podcasts. most people just arent interesting enough.

    Hey now, I resemble that remark!
    --
    digital man (rob)

    Synchronet "Real Fact" #17:
    "Vertrauen" (ver-trow-en) translates to "trust" in German, and was a band name Norco, CA WX: 63.1F, 52.0% humidity, 0 mph ENE wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs ---
    Synchronet Vertrauen Home of Synchronet [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net
  • From MRO@VERT/BBSESINF to Digital Man on Sat Dec 2 06:56:27 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: Digital Man to MRO on Fri Dec 01 2023 12:20 pm

    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Nov 28 2023 05:01 am

    it reminds me about when everyone was trying to do podcasts. most people just arent interesting enough.

    Hey now, I resemble that remark!

    It's harder than it looks. it's hard to be good on radio.
    We have a radio pair here that is great at talking sports, great at all the online banter. When they interview a celebrity it is so horrible and cringe-worthy. They don't know what questions to ask. it's like 'what is your favorite color' type stuff.

    they can get by coasting and sound like great friends with everyone at the station they talk with. it works for them.
    ---
    Synchronet ::: BBSES.info - free BBS services :::
  • From Boraxman@VERT/MSRDBBS to MRO on Sun Dec 3 22:14:52 2023
    Re: Re: Hey folks
    By: MRO to poindexter FORTRAN on Tue Nov 28 2023 05:01 am

    i never liked blogs. most people were boring.
    now most blogs are just advertisements thinly diguised as blogs.

    it reminds me about when everyone was trying to do podcasts. most people just arent interesting enough.

    I agree. There are very, very few blogs that I find are worth reading, and those are usually artiles posted as if they were blog posts, rather than actual blog posts.

    ---
    Synchronet MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org